Amsterdam showed the way

[schmoak]

On 7/23/2020 at 0:41 PM, marcjuna said:

Much like going to the pub for draught lagers, I would be quite happy to be able to go for a coffee spliff in a coffee shop.

Just not going to be anywhere near Amsterdam to enjoy it.

Yes, it's essential, free and convenient to have fresh ground coffee with demerara to compliment own cured bud early in the morning, but what strikes me as fantastic was having delicious dutch coffee made and served with frothy hot milk accompanied with a firm offer of a diverse range of hashes and buds to immediately select and sample at will at your liberty in a comfortable cozy harmonious relaxing setting in peace and security, warmed and welcomed.

 Yes certainly the rest of the Netherlands has marvelous Cannabis history too, but just as a destination which gives one such a huge selection over a huge area with all the other cultural attractions in great abundance.

 All in one magnificence of being with everyone from all over the world to do everything together and certainly smoke cannabis and accept the whole city is high and stoned and is Ok, it's grand and it's very colourful.

 But seriously, to have 3-4 selections of good weed to sample over coffee at 9.30 in the morning is a vital experience. Every one chatting eagerly and enjoying their sunny morning, houseplants, cats and sunflowers, go outside and stroll along the canals, enjoy being with stoners all weekend long, great therapy for PTSD after been fecked about by shite hawkers at home. it showed me the way of how good life could be compared to the life being lived in soapbar and alcohol hellhole.

Peace

[iShouldCoCo]

I will have to wrack my brains to remember the 9 days I spent in Amsterdam in the 90s - I remember finding a couple of preferred places. Cafe... ummmm.... Cafe 96? No 92? Meh! I do remember the Moon River Hash and Peach Loaza (sp?) but I actually enjoyed the vibe (and prices and quality) in smaller towns like Leiden and some other small place I stayed at in Northern NL with a very open-minded couple but TBH, I struggle to remember their names now, never mind the names of the Coffeeshops... Her name was Heidi I think

[schmoak]

Sunday morning here in Spain, sunshine & blue sky, coffee & croissant and a tasty pinner blended of 3 vars, up on the terrace looking at the shining sea, it's bliss.

But I just found myself LOLing remembering what it was like to wake up in Amsterdam from about 06.00 and onward till Noon. One would wake n bake and have juice or a beer before breakfast proper downstairs, Then out on the street for 10.00 and staight to th coffee shop to have coffee and 2-3 choices of best buds and hash to roll from... really though one pinner would be enough at that time and so after 1/2 hour one would go visit another cofffeeshop and get another 2-3 vars and smoke another pinner and now because one has 5-6 vars in pocket and is studying them one begins to roll another so to compare the differences and different characteristics, of course now it's 11.15 and one has had 3 pure joints and is now on the way to another coffeeshop to see...

 What's new?  11.40 and one is happy with the latest purchases and is just finishing rolling another joint!! but now it's nearly 12.00 midday and One feels a little shy of busy crowds and tries to go for a walk.... Best get a pair of sunglasses.... Quick! Only in Amsterdam.

[schmoak]

"Showed me the way to go Home  "  and now it looks like We foreigners are being shown the door...

 

Residents-only rule for coffeeshops proposed in Amsterdam

Amsterdam city council is gearing up for a new discussion on banning non-residents from its coffeeshops next month, after two new proposals were submitted. Although a national law says only Dutch residents can buy cannabis from the shops, Amsterdam has never enforced the ruling. When Dutch drug laws were tightened in 2013, there were concerns that the residents-only rule would drive dealing onto the street and create more nuisance, the late Amsterdam mayor Eberhard van der Laan said at the time. But now thanks to a citizen’s petition and new set of proposals from the opposition VVD party, a foreign visitor ban is back on the table and up for debate again. Increasing numbers of councillors believe that a vote could be a close one, with a new drive to change the type of tourist who chooses to visit.

 

In recent years, as city ombudsman Arre Zuurmond noted, increasing nuisance from partying tourists has made some parts of central Amsterdam an inadequately policed ‘jungle’. Earlier this year, mayor Femke Halsema warned that there was not enough space for the normal tourist load, and the city asked for emergency powers to close hotels if necessary. Meanwhile, the local government has been cracking down on tourist nuisance, banning Airbnb-type rentals in three central areas, regulating tours, and launching a review of prostitution windows and crackdown on criminality around coffeeshops. A recent briefing from Halsema said the council also wants to ‘reduce the pulling power’ of cannabis on tourists, and a highly critical report last year proposed enforcing the non-resident rule. Easy drugs ‘Two years ago, when ChristenUnie proposed it, a lot of parties didn’t see the benefit but I think more and more parties endorse this policy change,’ said Don Ceder, leader of the ChristenUnie in Amsterdam. ‘Specific crowds came back after lockdown, and we are seeing disturbances increasing again even though we don’t have the same number of people. It’s time to look at the international image and I think a residents-only policy for coffeeshops could really help,’ he said. ‘Then it would no longer be the city of easy drugs but a city that attracts different crowds. If a lot of people come who don’t cause problems, there is room for more of a visitor-based economy.’

 

Robert Overmeer, owner of the Brug 34 bar and chairman of the BIZ Utrechtsestraat local traders’ group, set up the Stop Het Drugstoerisme campaign and petition. He has won enough public votes to spark a discussion in council and will argue that many drug tourists who have returned do little to increase hotel occupancy and support bars and restaurants, but create the same levels of nuisance. Stoned ‘The real thing is to change the perception of people who come to Amsterdam that it’s a city where they can use drugs and f*** prostitutes,’ he said. ‘We want people who are interested in the city and culture, museums, food – not only people with money. We don’t have the feeling that the people who come for drugs even enjoy the city: they are stoned all the time.’ He added that even when an estimated 75% of tourist numbers returned in the summer, his colleagues in the hotel industry still had up to 15% occupancy: ‘I see [tourists] sleeping in the cars, pooping and pissing out of the car, leaving all [their rubbish] behind and of course taking drugs back and that will pay for the trip.’ He said that the tourist industry should be prepared to take a loss now in order to make a ‘radical shift’. ‘We should set the new target on the horizon, then it will be clear for everybody that we don’t want these people,’ he said.

 

Balance A spokesman for Amsterdam’s VVD told DutchNews.nl that its proposals to put ‘balance’ back into the red light district aim to change Amsterdam’s reputation as a destination for drugs, sex, alcohol and misbehaviour. The proposals call for far-reaching rules. ‘The relative quiet as a result of the coronacrisis gives us the unique chance to bring peace back to this historic part of our inner city, but this requires quick, vigorous action,’ the motion states. Dennis Boutkan, tourism spokesman for Amsterdam’s PvdA, agreed that there needs to be a ‘broader vision’ of the inner city and efforts to attract more business visitors, but said a key issue is how a residents-only policy would be policed. ‘The residents-only rule could contribute to a better image in terms of foreign tourists, so that they don’t just come here to smoke dope, but if street dealing grows, then it is not a good solution,’ he said. ‘The broader question is the capacity of the police, because we have a big problem with a shortage of police and street wardens. Struggle ‘However, something has to change with the image of the city abroad, because we want other kinds of tourists. It’s going to be a long struggle.’ Although the mayor of Amsterdam mentioned the residents-only discussion in passing during a council meeting several weeks ago – saying she thought there was ‘no majority’ for it – futher clarification was not available. Two spokespeople for Halsema did not return repeated calls from DutchNews.nl. The Bond van Cannabis Detaillisten, which represents coffeeshop owners, is understood to strongly oppose the proposals and is currently campaigning against street dealing. DutchNews.nl has approached the association for a comment.

Read more at DutchNews.nl:

https://www.dutchnews.nl/news/2020/09/residents-only-rule-for-coffeeshops-proposed-in-amsterdam/

 

Edited September 27, 2020 by schmoak

[Michael Luchóg]

I just had a thought ,and both Cambium and I walked the same streets on the same year ,but it's dodgy in coffeeshops for sure, well generally . I miss the freedom of having the choice ,the availability of cannabis of course .

 

The smaller towns ,and more residential area coffeeshops have nicer weed alright . Turnstiles would almost put me off going in . There are a few barge boat shops ,maybe one in each city ,and one I used to go to was similar to one mentioned earlie ,except only the hash was good in my opinion ,but three fellas ran the place .One was from Suriname or Surinamese origin ,nice fellas .The place was like a pre-school ,students drinking lattes ,it was friendly and they wouldn't have had the clientele for expensive buds or spend thrifty tourists . I didn't mind ,but some places were dingy ,dark and dicey in comparison ,yet you'd be a stranger and meet someone local or learn something .Same with the Turkish barbers ,they didn't expect the euro foreign nationals to enter their shops so when you went in it was a smitten of a lesson on urban and arabic culture  . Certainly a bit different ,to me bck then it was gay being so pampered !

This new proposal was enforced in Maastricht and some nearby towns . I was picked from a queue and asked to leave as I wasn't from ''here'', and an English lady also .I said my piece ,it was definitely strange and discriminatory but no one in the queue wanted to help .I can tell you for certain ,in other parts of the world someone would have spoke up or taken my money and purchased the weed for me . I was having a think ,with the English lady outside the door and we were asked to move away . The town is a bit infamous anyway ,but that was pretty shit .If it happened now I'd feel worse and I'd be more vocal . The person ,kloottzak that asked me to leave was not Dutch or European . Another nearby shop ,also non national attendant ,said to me that people in this country have mobile phones ,after I asked nicely for the wifi password with an open laptop in my hands  ,and I responded to the dude ,that people in every country have mobile phones ,and the security guard laughed .I had spent a year there already,just not these toens or shops  . I wasn't handling this too well in my head with 100 euro tram and train tickets and being refused a sale . I had bought weed .I'm not sure ,may have asked for my money back ,can't remember . Shit rap music ,shapers bumping fists ,fuck that ,but it is a diverse place Holland ,and some coffeeshops are alright. Many nice towns where folks salute . There's interesting characters and sober true life stories in midday stoner joints ,even in Amsterdam ,but it's sh1te for the most regarding weed and hash . If coffeeshops weren't accessible for tourists then there's the internet to fill the gap ,and any amount of cunning ways around legislation .It's unlikely tough ,I'd imagine . You can't even go for a drive in the mountains /forestry because there isn't any . 

 

[schmoak]

Well said @Michael Luchóg (Silc ?) So you've been refused in holland? That's was so rough and ignorant of them 'specially since you were part (1 year) of the society at that stage. The "shit rap music" (drill rap?) is probably played to keep folk from relaxing and settling into the seats for to long, it's mental when all the shops are playing it year in year out. Maastrict? that was years ago when they stopped border towns business, there was a good one in Terneuzen called the Checkpoint, Formula 1 flags, it had a huge car park to accommodate the drivers of france, belguim and (hot off a ryan air plane), hire cars from Ireland.

 Totally different Cannabis available back then than the watery insipid rubbish available today.

 These days one got the impression that the objective is simply to sell a beverage and secondary and thirdly rated bud that the growers would'nt want for themselves or their clients, somebody has to smoke it.

   Anyways sure we're growing Cali and Beyond now so going to the Coffeeshop for Cannabis has become a bit of a nonsense, it's just the 50 year project should have showed the way to the British, Irish and other Europeans that it was ok and a good idea to let folk have their cosy space in town rather than wind blasted pub backstreet or underhand sneaky stuff.

Back then, offseason, it was both easier and quicker to 'score' good Cannabis by jumping on a plane than phoning the local dealer who could take half a day or two to materialise  with expensive rubbish deals, it was easier quicker (1 hour) and with careful shopping, cheaper to fly to holland for the weekend and have Tasty Dutyfree for a couple of weeks into the bargain. Good times to have those old time dutch nuggs in store back when there was no weed available for love or money.

 Anyway these are different days everywhere, it's all on it's head, Head

 

[Siffo]

On 23/07/2020 at 0:06 AM, QuintinQuick said:

How can you not love the Dam!!!

Of course - you have to avoid the rip off joints, but thats the same in any city.

My only complaint - its so much more expensive nowadays - 25guilders would get you a long way in the 80s.

 

Anyone been to Christiania recently? - a sad sight to see pusher street in such demise - I remember the market stalls displaying all sorts of quality hash and weed for reasonable prices - must have been early nineties and without doubt the best market I have ever visited.

 

I got the best hash I have ever smoked in my life there... Was super clean high, if I had to describe it was like being amazingly stoned but super clarity with 0 paranoia that normally gets me with uplifting strains. 

 

No idea what it was called but if money and wife were permitting I'd go back just to go there to try and find it smoke it again find out what it is and grow it.. it was that good. 

[schmoak]

Of course it was Amsterdam which opened our eyes colourfully, spectacularly, fantastically   but really, this OP Thread Title should read

Holland showed the Way. Although we tourists experienced  Amsterdam's liberal wonders, it was all due to the Dutch people deciding on decriminalisation for the whole Nation.

 I mention this now in relation to what may have been fundamentally much more important and that was the accepted  tolerance in allowing persons to grow 5 plants outdoors. The rest of the world is now catching up but the Dutch really had the best system back then and so much more for the small country which had the big heart to share it with us pilgrims.

 Well here we are a century later past Nineteen 1999 but some governments (British, Irish = Briarish) are still pushing their prohibition drug war on to the peaceful cannabis using populations, it needs to be charged before the Dutch International Criminal Court.

[catfish]

On 23/07/2020 at 0:06 AM, QuintinQuick said:

25guilders would get you a long way in the 80s

that was 40 years ago mate tell me what 25 guilders would buy nowdays of anything ?

[QQ710]

5 hours ago, catfish said:

that was 40 years ago mate tell me what 25 guilders would buy nowdays of anything ?

A gram of average bud in most places

I've still got a 25guilder note here somewhere - just for momento

[schmoak]

  It's such an odd situation to have had one European country who shone an exemplary light in allowing the sale and consumption of Cannabis.

   Times have changed.

   I could'nt imagine wanting to visit a country which employs prohibition or prohibition of tourists, just that vibe is enough to turn me off and the music has turned shit too!

    About time the pathetic prohibitory countries did the decent thing to permit their own people to enjoy normal relations with Cannabis.

 As a showcase of success  Amsterdam Showed The Way

[Conroy]

19 minutes ago, schmoak said:

  It's such an odd situation to have had one European country who shone an exemplary light in allowing the sale and consumption of Cannabis.

   Times have changed.

   I could'nt imagine wanting to visit a country which employs prohibition or prohibition of tourists, just that vibe is enough to turn me off and the music has turned shit too!

    About time the pathetic prohibitory countries did the decent thing to permit their own people to enjoy normal relations with Cannabis.

 As a showcase of success  Amsterdam Showed The Way

Maybe with recent developments in the USA things worldwide will change sooner rather than later.

 

The M.O.R.E act will surely pass through the Senate at some point this year and with the WHO and subsequently the UN changing their stance recently a lot more westernised countries will be changing their stance with a bit of luck.

 

Maybe even us once everyone in government that needs to has assured themselves of their place at the trough.

[schmoak]

Hiya @Conroy But we remember debating with those same sentiments 10 years ago, used to get a heavy time from the DM'ers regards us trying to infect the nation with schizophrenia?  I'd sometimes say "well look at holland"  "do you think the Dutch Government are trying to destroy their people?"

 I'm afraid to say say it but the while Holland showed one thing, Britain and Ireland showed another thing to compare with. It is what it is.

BTW Both the UN + EU have been openly clearly most in agreement with countries choosing to go full legal or any which way suits for at least 10 years too.

   Mean-Spirited (evol) Prohibitive Government and Voters keep it Nasty, imo.

 

[Conroy]

1 hour ago, schmoak said:

Hiya @Conroy But we remember debating with those same sentiments 10 years ago, used to get a heavy time from the DM'ers regards us trying to infect the nation with schizophrenia?  I'd sometimes say "well look at holland"  "do you think the Dutch Government are trying to destroy their people?"

 I'm afraid to say say it but the while Holland showed one thing, Britain and Ireland showed another thing to compare with. It is what it is.

BTW Both the UN + EU have been openly clearly most in agreement with countries choosing to go full legal or any which way suits for at least 10 years too.

   Mean-Spirited (evol) Prohibitive Government and Voters keep it Nasty, imo.

 

You may well be correct. 

 

But the UN have only just voted to reschedule it and the US will likely soon federally decriminilise, the world is a lot smaller than it was, people know people in other countries where its legal, CBD is gathering pace, have faith

[schmoak]

1 hour ago, Conroy said:

But the UN have only just voted to reschedule it

 Nah, I remember arguing this back then ....

  

https://www.cannabisculture.com/content/2009/06/24/un-backs-drug-decriminalization-world-drug-report/

"UN Backs Drug Decriminalization In World Drug Report

By Ryan Grim, The Huffington Post on June 24, 2009

FacebookTwitterRedditPinterest

Share

In an about face, the United Nations on Wednesday lavishly praised drug decriminalization in its annual report on the state of global drug policy.

In previous years, the UN drug czar had expressed skepticism about Portugal’s decriminalization, which removed criminal penalties in 2001 for personal drug possession and emphasized treatment over incarceration. The UN had suggested the policy was in violation of international drug treaties and would encourage “drug tourism.”

But in its 2009 World Drug Report, the UN had little but kind words for Portugal’s radical (by U.S. standards) approach. “These conditions keep drugs out of the hands of those who would avoid them under a system of full prohibition, while encouraging treatment, rather than incarceration, for users. Among those who would not welcome a summons from a police officer are tourists, and, as a result, Portugal’s policy has reportedly not led to an increase in drug tourism,” reads the report. “It also appears that a number of drug-related problems have decreased.”

In its upbeat appraisal of Portugal’s policy, the UN finds itself in agreement with Salon’s Glenn Greenwald.

The report, released at the National Press Club in Washington, D.C., also puts to rest concerns that decriminalization doesn’t comply with international treaties, which prevent countries from legalizing drugs.

U.S. Drug Czar Gil Kerlikowske is scheduled to appear at the announcement of the report. (He has said “decriminalization” is not “in my vocabulary.”)

“The International Narcotics Control Board was initially apprehensive when Portugal changed its law in 2001 (see their annual report for that year), but after a mission to Portugal in 2004, it “noted that the acquisition, possession and abuse of drugs had remained prohibited,” and said “the practice of exempting small quantities of drugs from criminal prosecution is consistent with the international drug control treaties,” reads a footnote to the report.

The UN report also dives head first into the debate over full drug legalization. Last year’s World Drug Report ignored the issue entirely, save for a reference to Chinese opium policy in the 19th Century. This year’s report begins with a lengthy rebuttal of arguments in favor of legalization. “Why unleash a drug epidemic in the developing world for the sake of libertarian arguments made by a pro-drug lobby that has the luxury of access to drug treatment?” argues the report.

But the UN also makes a significant concession to backers of legalization, who have long argued that it is prohibition policies that lead to violence and the growth of shadowy, underground networks.

“In the Preface to the report,” reads the press release accompanying the report, “[UN Office of Drugs and Crime Executive Director Antonio Maria] Costa explores the debate over repealing drug controls. He acknowledges that controls have generated an illicit black market of macro-economic proportions that uses violence and corruption.”

Jack Cole, executive director of Law Enforcement Against Prohibition (LEAP) and a retired undercover narcotics detective, objected to the report’s classification of current policy as “control.”

“The world’s ‘drug czar,’ Antonio Maria Costa, would have you believe that the legalization movement is calling for the abolition of drug control,” he said. “Quite the contrary, we are demanding that governments replace the failed policy of prohibition with a system that actually regulates and controls drugs, including their purity and prices, as well as who produces them and who they can be sold to. You can’t have effective control under prohibition, as we should have learned from our failed experiment with alcohol in the U.S. between 1920 and 1933.”

– Article from The Huffington Post.

Read the full UN World Drug Report 2009.

 

 The difficulty back then was the Daily-Blackmailers took the moral high ground in the dabate.

 We Knew it was lies then like we know it's all lies now.  Pure TV Fiction/Addiction.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 11, 2021 by schmoak
Link