Should the UK legalize cannabis? - Poll

[Gimps]

@@Hughie Green Didn't someone find traces in clay pipes from the Elizabethan period?

Hemp has a long history of use in this country...

Edited April 25, 2015 by Gimps

[the_pimp]

85% of people that don't have a bloody clue what they are talking about, never mind, keep asking for the impossible that's just the way they like it.

And 99% of people know what the question means without taking it to the 27th degree of legal interpretation.

"Do you want to be able to buy and smoke cannabis without being arrested?", whether thats decriminalised, normalised or pasteurised doesnt really matter.

[Hughie Green]

@@Hughie Green Didn't someone find traces in clay pipes from the Elizabethan period?

Hemp has a long history of use in this country...

Not heard of that mate, they could argue that it doesn't occur naturally here?, either way they will not admit historical use despite any evidence, as we know the establishment is fond of ignoring the evidence about cannabis.

@@the_pimp

Nothing to do with degrees of legal interpretation the law is plainly stated, possession of cannabis without a licence is the offence, it is our possession of cannabis that is deemed unlawful or illegal not cannabis itself, the barriers to legalisation of possession are the same as the barriers to the "legalisation" of cannabis, one cant be done because cannabis is not illegal so cant be legalised and the other is specifically forbidden by the terms of the UN single convention,

asking for something that is specifically forbidden by international agreement and is beyond the ability and desire of the government

is complete ignorance of the facts, do they really know what it means? if so why are they demanding the least likely scenario if they know the facts?

there is only one achievable option and that is decriminalisation of possession but apparently that is a shit idea but it doesn't stop

people going to the countries that have decriminalised like Holland for over 40 years or Spain, Portugal, if legalisation is so achieveable

why have other countries opted for decriminalisation, you can disagree with my opinion all you like but facts and precedent show I am correct in my assessment.

[Gimps]

@@Hughie Green, Can't find the link regarding Elizabethan heads, I remember the tagline was something like "Shakespere smoked dope" or some such tabloid bollocks, but place names like Broadhempston, Hemel hempstead etc all point to it's long established use, though perhaps more to do with fibre than smoking. I belive the plant was established here shortly after the Romans left. Saying all that I suspect you're right, it wouldn't make the slightest difference to the government if St George smoked dry sift...

[Hughie Green]

Hemp was important to the navy for rigging and sails as well as all the other uses for rope and canvas cloth.

Edited April 25, 2015 by Hughie Green

[Victor Kruger]

Hemp was important to the navy for rigging and sails as well as all the other uses for rope and canvas cloth.

Hemp has a lot more history of use here than just supplying the royal navy.

History of Hemp Cultivation in Britain

Cannabis hemp was widely grown across Britain in the Middle Ages, from at least 800 to 1800 AD, though the amount grown varied widely through the centuries. It was mainly grown for fibre which was used to make sails, ropes, fishing nets and clothes. Old clothes were recycled into paper. Oil was produced from the seeds and was burned in lamps. It may also have been used as a folk medicine and for food, but it's a mystery whether or not it was taken as a drug. In this section we'll first explain what types of evidence of hemp cultivation there is, then summarise where and when hemp was grown in Britain.

The evidence that hemp was grown in Britain comes in several different forms. First there is some written evidence in parish records and government reports. There aren't that many references to hemp, because agricultural practices were not widely written about. Secondly there are many places in Britain today with names such as Hemphill or Hempriggs, and many more places are marked on old maps such as Hemp-buttis, Hempisfield and Hempriggis. Thirdly there is evidence from pollen analysis of lake sediments, although again not much for two reasons. Firstly the sites chosen for pollen studies, tended to avoid agriculturally favourable areas. Secondly, until 1987 it was diffficult to identify hemp's pollen. Sediment accumulates slowly at the bottom of lakes and the pollen of whatever plants were grown around the lake is buried with it. A metre of sediment contains a few hundred years of history, and deeper you core the older it gets. The sediment can be carbon-dated or there may be distinctive bands of other plants' pollen which have known dates. Gradual variations in the amount of hemp grown can be seen across the years.

England

There was an early peak in hemp production in England from 800 - 1000 AD, followed by a slackening in interest by farmers as new crops were discovered. In the early sixteenth century hemp was re-introduced and its growth recommended. Large quantities of hemp were needed to supply the English navy, and Henry the Eighth ordered his subjects to grow hemp. Large amounts of hemp were grown in the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, but not enough for the British Navy - the war against Napolean's France in 1812 was fought, in part, to control the supplies of Russian hemp. In Victorian times peasant produced imported hemp undercut domestic hemp, and its growth died out in Britain.

Scotland

Hemp didn't appear in Scotland until about 1000 AD, 200 years later than in England. There was a general explosion in agriculture around this time (shown in the pollen records) and hemp was one of a number of crops, such as cereals and carrotts, that were grown widely for the first time. By 1200 agriculture became more intensive in Scotland, and specialist crops were grown in different areas. Thus hemp became less common in most of Scotland, but stayed an important crop near the fishing communities where hemp was used for fishing nets, ropes and sails for the fishing boats, and where manure and seaweed were availiable for fertilizer. Hemp was grown in Scotland up to the 18th century when hemp fields were replaced by the wooded estates of the gentry. Place names which still exist include:

Hemphill (Kilmarnock Parish, Aryshire)

Hempland (Torthorwald, Dumfriesshire)

Hempriggs (Wick, Caithness)

Hempy Shot (Oldhamstocks, East Lothian)

Placenames found on old maps include: Hemp-buttis (1556, Auchtermuchty, Fife) Hempriggis (1571, Alves, Morayshire) Hempisfield (1642, Plenderleith, Roxburghshire) Hempshaugh (1663, Selkirk)

The Kelton (Kirkcudbright-shire) Kirk Session Minutes of 1724 mentioned that a man appeared before the church court because he had thrown a woman against a hemp rigg, while another old history book records that a papal legate travelling in Scotland in the fifteenth century observed in every rural habitation, the people employed in speparating the hemp from the stalks. Other old books mentioned hemp being grown in:

• Lewis, Outer Hebrides, 1771
• Islay, Inner Hebrides, 1814
• Mouswald parish, Dumfriesshire, early 18th century

Two lake cores, taken from Black Loch in north-west Fife (near Newburgh) and Kilconquhar Loch in south-east Fife (near Elie) were analysed for hemp pollen. In Black Loch cannabis appeared around 1045, at the time of the increase in agriculture. Large amounts of hemp were grown until 1210 after which there was a decline and no more hemp was grown after 1265. In Kilconquhar Loch however hemp pollen was found consistently throughout the core, only dissapearing during the eighteenth century.

In Medieval times religious hospitals commonly grew hemp. Hemp features in the recommended plants section of the great religious gardening books! Many monastic houses have areas of land named after hemp, and some have remenants of hemp-retting pools. It is likely that hemp was mainly grown for its fibre, but also for medicine for the hospitals. Little evidence exists of the growth of hemp at archeological sites because traditional archeologists threw away the soil etc looking for artifacts. Only a few environmental archeologists bothered to look for (and find) hemp pollen in the grounds of medieval hospitals.

References

SHARP (1989) Third report into the medieval hospital at Soutra, Lothian/Borders Region, Scotland. ISBN 09511888 28 Whittington.Scottish Geographical Magazine 160.http://www.ukcia.org/culture/history/hmpukhis.php p167-1

Edited April 25, 2015 by Victor Kruger

[Hughie Green]

I know, I was trying to keep it brief, I thought " as well as all the other uses for rope and canvas cloth." covered it.

[Victor Kruger]

Possession of cannabis can not be legalised because of the single convention on narcotics anyone who thinks or believes otherwise

is ignorant of the facts and barking up the wrong tree.

Well you were going on about no traditional use, how far back do you wish to go ? 800 AD is some way from 1800 AD and you wernt mentioning anything about its varied uses like oil, clothing or parchment

its simple science once the technique's and technology allows it and the establishment cannot refute science fact, the single convention of narcotics can be challenged and overturned or simply ignored ( as with Uruguay ) and I believe at some point others will follow. It wasnt there before and nothing stays the same forever, might feel like it but an ever changing world guarantees it wont.