New Grow

[terminal velocity]

a tube is a tube man no matter what they call it!!

I dont think so kind sir,..... these are Hight output t5s. they seem to be working fine...

[compostverte]

The last hyped linears we saw here were some very expensive internally mirrored ones ...

The idea of places like this is that hopefully newbies come and research and ask questions before they spend their money.

People like me have made pretty well all the mistakes and hope we can steer others away from the rocks .. though I was lucky enough to come to indoor growing 15 years ago as an electronics techie / energy efficiency enthusiast with 10 years' gardening experience.

That aside, we will be able to help you to do the best with what you have. :bunny:

[acidmonkey]

a tube is a tube man no matter what they call it!!

I dont think so kind sir,..... these are Hight output t5s. they seem to be working fine...

what i mean is it's not an hps is it

it IS a tube...

fair play it's a carlos fandago t5 but you won't get the same results compared to an hps there buddy.. :bunny:

e2a i wish you good luck with your venture and show us old hps farts that with new high tech tubes you can achieve your goal and stick two fingers up at us..

Edited June 18, 2010 by acidmonkey

[terminal velocity]

The last hyped linears we saw here were some very expensive internally mirrored ones ...

The idea of places like this is that hopefully newbies come and research and ask questions before they spend their money.

People like me have made pretty well all the mistakes and hope we can steer others away from the rocks .. though I was lucky enough to come to indoor growing 15 years ago as an electronics techie / energy efficiency enthusiast with 10 years' gardening experience.

That aside, we will be able to help you to do the best with what you have. :bunny:

thanks man I appreciate it, However I think I made a good choice, been looking around on other forums and Ive seen where others have used the exact light im using, the pioneer VIII from sunleaves, with the t5 High Output tubes and doing great... able to keep the light one inch from the plant.... makes sense to me

[compostverte]

High Output tubes and doing great... able to keep the light one inch from the plant.... makes sense to me

The snag is what happens when the plant is 2 or 3 feet tall ?

It's a high light plant with structure and the top leaves block the light.

I've only recently given myself a refresher by raising hundreds of veggie and ornamental plants under fluorescents. They're ideal for the first week or maybe two ... at which point they go under the HPS and rocket away - then they get the sun - an even brighter light at an even greater distance.

The 9 inches from the lamp to the canopy is a positive boon.

Horizontal linears is what people choose when they have no choice - limited height.

You're going to have to SCROG to make this work convincingly, and I've never understood how you do that from unsexed seed ..

If you'd lived locally you could have had a dozen 4 foot linears I've been sitting on for 15 years waiting for a project - a space where they would be the only solution ...

(I started out using them vertically !)

[Arnold Layne]

Sorry but that's all bollocks.

...

Compost mate, my vegging wardrobe which holds all my mums, all my cuts and all my seedlings, is lit by one (1) single Linear rated at 110Watts. Its five years old at least, and has been running either 24/7 or 18/6 all the time (I swap between the two depending what I believe at the time )

They may well not be the best, but they do manage some jobs rather well

But you're right - for flowering no way would I use this. So my Flowering Wradrobe has a nice shiny new 250 HID, which has both MH and HPS bulbs. MH for weeks 1-2 or 3, and also for weeks 6 or 7 - chop time.

[compostverte]

Hi Arnie,

Yes - I really ought to try harder.

I sometimes sound like John Cleese's "Ivan The Terrible" in a certain management training video from the 80s ..

.. but I've reached that time of life

[acidmonkey]

Hi Arnie,

Yes - I really ought to try harder.

I sometimes sound like John Cleese's "Ivan The Terrible" in a certain management training video from the 80s ..

.. but I've reached that time of life

don't worry compo i quite often put my foot in it...yeah it's an age thang

we're a pair of grumpy old men..

[terminal velocity]

Well I don't believe Im going to have any issues flowering with this light.

But youre right about one thing .... Not with unsexed seeds.

this grow is supposed to be a way to get my feet wet again before I go on putting some seeds worth a darn in there and potentially waste that money, so I just got these out of a sack of some really really good stuff I got from a friend.. I figure I get this grow under my belt work through all the kinks of my new system and then order some seeds that work with what I have.

Now the reason I decided to go with this light is because the box is in my bedroom and HPS and MH lights are kinda loud and kinda hot ( at least the 150 HPS and 175 MH I have are) That being said I researched the light ( Sunleaves Pioneer VIII) looked at a few forums and checked out my cousins grow who is using the Sunleaves Pioneer VIII which is the same light as mine. ( His light consistently puts out around 3k foot candles ) which is if im not mistaken is something around 32k lux forgive me if I'm wrong but isnt that comparable to a 600 wat hps ?

as far as light getting to the lower sections of the plant you are right. I have figured that I will need additional lighting which I can get single T5 HO tubes from the same place for around 32 dollars mind you the entire light i have only cost 250 us dollars. and then grab up a 150 CFL maybe to keep a mother under once I get to that.

So my light is 47.5 inches left to right, 24.5 inches front to back so I built my box around that light cause i figured since the light is flat it wont put out light in a bowl light an HID but rather just a flat surface of light so I didnt need anything trying to grow anywhere this blanket of light isnt above.

I just figured maybe if you understood why I chose this light it would shed some light on the situation and you could help me better,... at at least not think Im a total jackarse.

Ive got some Jack Herer seeds but those grow tall... Not really what I wanna grow right now, got any ideas for a strain that produces high yeilds, good smoke, easy to grow , that grows short ?

[compostverte]

Now the reason I decided to go with this light is because the box is in my bedroom and HPS and MH lights are kinda loud and kinda hot ( at least the 150 HPS and 175 MH I have are) That being said I researched the light ( Sunleaves Pioneer VIII) looked at a few forums and checked out my cousins grow who is using the Sunleaves Pioneer VIII which is the same light as mine. ( His light consistently puts out around 3k foot candles ) which is if im not mistaken is something around 32k lux forgive me if I'm wrong but isnt that comparable to a 600 wat hps ? now, got any ideas for a strain that produces high yeilds, good smoke, easy to grow , that grows short ?

nope. It's nearer to the output of a 250 watt HPS. (27,000)

Your 4 foot tubes are apparently 54 watts - explaining the increase in lumens over the 4 foot linears I used for the first year. (incidentally, I have recently realised that my relative success with those was because I wrapped lanky plants around vertically mounted tubes so got the light right into the bud structure.)

So total power is 432 watts - and in practice that means darn near 400 watts of heat as no lighting technology is very efficient - even the most efficient of all, the 600 watt HPS.

You're confusing "hot to the touch" with "heat"

I can't believe you still confuse these two if you already have an HID lamp to compare it with.

The main difference is that the ballasts in a linear assembly are multiple and mounted on a large heatsink. I have some 25 watt CFLs where the electronic ballasts are superficially as painful to touch as a 250 watt HPS.

The principle reason for good ventilation, by the way, is not to shift heat, but to provide CO2 for growth - which quickly becomes an isue in any enclosed space.(explaining my own rather pants yields :wink:) In most countries though, the initial motivation is odour control.

As I said earlier, being able to get the lamps closer is not a benefit in a plant with structure.

These linear assemblies are designed for early vegetative growth - i.e. raising seedlings or wheatgrass for juicing.

As Arnie says, linears are an efficient choice for keeping mums and rooting cuttings, but not for growing, per se if you have a reasonable bit of headroom.

With careful training, fluorescent grows can produce half a gramme per watt, whereas HIDs double that.

There are , potentially, arguments for fluorescents and against HPS in terms of quality of the high - there was young chap on here a few years back called "babygro" who loved a good argument about PAR lumens et al.. :-

http://www.uk420.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=85128

In this hobby, it's generally best to go on the practical experience of thousands of growers, rather than theories ... it could have been much, much worse though. You could have spent thousands on LEDs ...

As I said, you can at least grow decent cannabis with fluorescents ... and there are SCROG experts here who will help you get the best from them.

Edited June 19, 2010 by compostverte

[compostverte]

Ive got some Jack Herer seeds but those grow tall... Not really what I wanna grow right now, got any ideas for a strain that produces high yeilds, good smoke, easy to grow , that grows short ?

Most cannabis, by nature is tall, but indoors we can control it.

The first question should be what sort of high you like ?

Relaxing or soaring ?

I'm guessing that in the USA you've had a range to try ?

Personally I need to have the whole spectrum available at all times.

If you're SCROGing, it could well be that a hybrid with quite a lot of sativa in it would be OK - so long as it isn't a Haaaaaaaaaze .... sativas are bendable and robust.

I grow sativa-rich hybrids in a tight space.

If Jack Herer is a smoke you like, go for it.

If you haven't already, Blab's bonsai grow is an inspiration to us all. His first version was with four 20 watt CFLs.

http://www.uk420.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=81536

He used Tiki's Yarkoum - an indica I may well be growing next.

Edited June 19, 2010 by compostverte

[terminal velocity]

Ive got some Jack Herer seeds but those grow tall... Not really what I wanna grow right now, got any ideas for a strain that produces high yeilds, good smoke, easy to grow , that grows short ?

Most cannabis, by nature is tall, but indoors we can control it.

The first question should be what sort of high you like ?

Relaxing or soaring ?

I'm guessing that in the USA you've had a range to try ?

Personally I need to have the whole spectrum available at all times.

If you're SCROGing, it could well be that a hybrid with quite a lot of sativa in it would be OK - so long as it isn't a Haaaaaaaaaze .... sativas are bendable and robust.

I grow sativa-rich hybrids in a tight space.

If Jack Herer is a smoke you like, go for it.

If you haven't already, Blab's bonsai grow is an inspiration to us all. His first version was with four 20 watt CFLs.

http://www.uk420.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=81536

He used Tiki's Yarkoum - an indica I may well be growing next.

q

I like a high where i can work or a giggly high euphoric type feeling actually.

Another question is. Im in week 2 of my veg and since height is an issue do you think it would be a bad idea to start flowering early? Right now they look to be doing ok... apart from some yellowing issues I believe are related to my nutes I think the ppm is off quite a bit . and my wifes dog got a lil hungry and ate the leaves off a couple.

[compostverte]

I like a high where i can work or a giggly high euphoric type feeling actually.

Another question is. Im in week 2 of my veg and since height is an issue do you think it would be a bad idea to start flowering early? Right now they look to be doing ok... apart from some yellowing issues I believe are related to my nutes I think the ppm is off quite a bit . and my wifes dog got a lil hungry and ate the leaves off a couple.

You've set yourself a huge challenge with your highly unusual choice of lights and a large number of unsexed seeds.

I can only vaguely remember one enthusiast of horizontal linears in several years of posting here.

How does your cousin use his ?

I really can't see any alternative to SCROG - in which case you start bending and perhaps pinching out quite soon

I personally wouldn't attempt SCROG except from cuttings where I knew how each individual plant was going to behave.

You won't know the sex until at least week 4, and looking at my last grow from mixed genetics, I was only beginning to work out the indica-sativa ratio around week 7. :-

http://www.uk420.com/boards/index.php?show...10977&st=75

The range of stretching in the first 2 weeks of 12/12 ranges from 2 times to 3 times depending on the genetics .. perhaps SCROGgers just pinch out the leader when they want to stop.

And then of course, removing the males will leave gaps ...

Though with your lights, growth rate is going to be a lot slower so you probably have some time to go yet ...

I've never done SCROG - you're going to have to start a new thread to find someone who's done something similar.

Good luck.

[terminal velocity]

I like a high where i can work or a giggly high euphoric type feeling actually.

Another question is. Im in week 2 of my veg and since height is an issue do you think it would be a bad idea to start flowering early? Right now they look to be doing ok... apart from some yellowing issues I believe are related to my nutes I think the ppm is off quite a bit . and my wifes dog got a lil hungry and ate the leaves off a couple.

You've set yourself a huge challenge with your highly unusual choice of lights and a large number of unsexed seeds.

I can only vaguely remember one enthusiast of horizontal linears in several years of posting here.

How does your cousin use his ?

I really can't see any alternative to SCROG - in which case you start bending and perhaps pinching out quite soon

I personally wouldn't attempt SCROG except from cuttings where I knew how each individual plant was going to behave.

You won't know the sex until at least week 4, and looking at my last grow from mixed genetics, I was only beginning to work out the indica-sativa ratio around week 7. :-

http://www.uk420.com/boards/index.php?show...10977&st=75

The range of stretching in the first 2 weeks of 12/12 ranges from 2 times to 3 times depending on the genetics .. perhaps SCROGgers just pinch out the leader when they want to stop.

And then of course, removing the males will leave gaps ...

Though with your lights, growth rate is going to be a lot slower so you probably have some time to go yet ...

I've never done SCROG - you're going to have to start a new thread to find someone who's done something similar.

Good luck.

yeah, I know that like I said earlier this grow is just to get my feet wet again and test this system out. I havent grown anything since 2006 and then that was my first grow.... I have some jack herrer that im holding off on growing... I was just wondering if you know any strains that would work better under my conditions ?

Edited June 19, 2010 by terminal velocity

[compostverte]

Hard to tell what Jack Herer is like the way it's hyped up by Sensi.

Basically what will work well under your very challenging conditions is a strain you've grown out under conventional lighting so you know how it will behave.

I started out with a skunk#1 pheno that was very sativa - at least 3/4 - grew it for years - knew exactly how it would behave - grew it first with vertical 4-footers - but had two sets - one veg, one flower - so I always had new plants to fill the gaps ...

So what does your cousin do with his light ?

Edited June 19, 2010 by compostverte