Astral Projection

[Guest fitduck]

More effective than what ?

the lucid dreaming techniques

[Twenty Three]

If you find visualisation easy,there's different techniques to try.Do you know about the method that uses a tarot card ?

Edited May 3, 2006 by Twenty_Three

[Guest fitduck]

If you find visualisation easy,there's different techniques to try.Do you know about the method that uses a tarot card ?

no not unless it involves visualising and concentrating on a symbol from the tarot card

[Twenty Three]

It's basically an extension of pathworking exercises where you choose a card and relax and study it,eventually visualising the card getting larger and larger until it's the size of a doorway that you walk through.

[Guest fitduck]

It's basically an extension of pathworking exercises where you choose a card and relax and study it,eventually visualising the card getting larger and larger until it's the size of a doorway that you walk through.

The one I have found most effective is simply visualising yourself 6 inches above or below your body as if u have floated or sunk out of your physical body. This coupled with controlled breathing will always get me to that 'jolt' stage, but it is getting beyond that that is more difficult.

[Lizard]

lucid dreaming is easy, I can do it in my sleep .

yeah I know, I'll get me coat.

[Father McPot]

lizard

So is the difference between lucid dreaming and astral projection this: in lucid you can do things like you can in astral but your not actually out of your body?

Can someone point out the main difference, i aint sure

[Spliffy]

Ketamine does it.

Your sat down, then suddenley your looking at yourself through the wall, then woooosh your flying over the top of yourself, looking at yourself, then booooom your off, then your sat back down thinking wtf was that. Then your brain itches :wink:

[HvyFuel]

lucid dreaming is easy, I can do it in my sleep .

:wink:

What's the difference between conscious fantasy and unconscious fantasy?

[Twenty Three]

What's the difference between conscious fantasy and unconscious fantasy?

Conscious fantasy is commonly referred to as "daydream" whereas unconscious fantasy is commonly referred to as "dream"

So is the difference between lucid dreaming and astral projection this: in lucid you can do things like you can in astral but your not actually out of your body?

It's the exact same vehicle that we use in lucid dream,the "astral" realms etc and to travel outside of the physical body in the physical world Smokey - ie,the double (or astral self).

The question you want to ask yourself is where do you think that lucid dreams are located ? Are they merely products of your subconscious or are they manifest at a non-local level ? Even if you think that dreams come from inside your head,science is yet to tell us where in the brain that dreams originate.

I believe that there are dreams that originate and are played out inside our minds during sleep.These are those "normal" dreams that are made up of hopes and fears concerning our day to day lives and the jumbled mish mash of things replayed from the previous day etc.But then we have "true" dream - those dreams which are bizarre,fantastical,spiritual,symbolic...it is these dreams that I believe exist,or at least originate,outside of our minds.

But then again,I also play around with the paradoxical theory that they're inside and outside at the exact same time.

Edited May 5, 2006 by Twenty_Three

[Weedling]

Very interesting thread

Are any of you guys familiar with "hemi-sync" or "brainwave mind voyages" ?

they are basically guided audio sessions for lucid dreaming, oobe's etc, but they have an added edge by using "binarual beats"

the binual beats help to sync the two hemispheres of your brain and and alter your mindstate etc.

ive only tryed the OBEE one so far, and i found it very powerfull, they are available on demonoid if it takes anyones fancy, you need a good set of sterio headphones for it to work properly also....

Enjoy,

Weedling.

[Bish]

Very interesting thread

Are any of you guys familiar with "hemi-sync" or "brainwave mind voyages" ?

[Guest dr rockster]

i've had a couple of experiences with oobe's that were a delibereate attempt on my part to dissaccociate my conciousness from my body during sleep. both times i did this the experience began with a feeling of my bed suddenly dissappearing beneath me and offering no support whatsoever. it's like a vacuous feeling in the pit of my stomach which is kind of scary.

then contrary to the books i've read on the subject i did not find myself standing at the foot of my bed looking at myself, rather i was floating either above myself or somewhere near the middle of the room. i remember making a concious effort to look at mysef to make sure i was actually out of my body.

the first time i did this i became aware that i was grinning (outside of my body) and then the grin turned to a fucking weird grotesque grimmace that completetly freaked me out and i felt myself SNAP back to normal awareness with a huge jolt like i had been electrocuted. this is a very strange feeling because immediately afterwards it felt like i was on the very edge of remembering something very deep and primordial. completely unique feeling

the second and last time i again found myself out of my body and floating in the proximity of the lightshade in the middle of the room. this time i was ready for the jolt and was determined not to "go back" .i remember conciously moving my awareness deliberately. and went over by the door then floating up near the light again.

when i was slightly more comfortable with this i tried to pass out of the window, and remember feeling stuck on the window. (on retrospect i believe that the residue of awareness from my normal state told me that i can't pass through glass and after a little panic i found myself back in my body, again with an electrifying snap.

both times i got out of my body by first doing an auto suggestion session before nodding off, suggesting to myself that when i fell asleep i would by an act of will leave my body and my conciousness would travel under my will.

i then curled up in a fetal position so my chest cavity ( and breathing was slightly constricted. this is reminiscent of Ausman Spare's death posture)

it's impossible to be objective about an experience like this and i'm aware that there is a high level of suggestion involved so i don't really see it as being some kind of proof of a soul or anything else.

i can tell you that there was a marked difference in the quality of experience compared to something like lucid dreaming in terms of the intensity of what i experienced. and i know it sounds crazy so please refrain from the sarcy comments

Hi Kyphi,

this is very interesting,especially with you making reference to 'electrifying snap' and coming immediately back to waking consciousness.When I was in my teens and early twenties I started getting very occasional waking paralysis,which when first experienced is quite terrifying as you wake up but can't move or call out,you are completely disconnected from all movement for a matter of a few seconds,and then it breaks through,a connection between your muscles and your nervous system.

Then I was getting dreams,usually just before nodding off or on waking,which would terminate in a huge flash,like a thousand amps going through a hundred amp fusebox,a white flash/bang and I'd be awake with my heart doing 200 bpm and I'm in a state of high anxiety and don't know why but I'm really shook up.

As well as this,I'd lie in bed sometimes and start to feel a rising electric voltage going through me(and my head)which was rather disconcerting as it felt so real I got out of bed and checked the electrical cables near appliances by the bed.

My point is,these 'bang' shock awakenings,paralysis,dreams,seemed so real but have the reality of the man with a fever if you get me?

Experienced usually on waking and sleeping.

I ask this if maybe you recognise something I've told you,about my rather strange experiences? It all seems to be electrical in origin.Neural that is.I look back on it now as some kind of minor thing many peeps experience.

People have abduction experiences where as young kids they get tired and fall asleep,during which time an abduction supposedly occurs.Now I don't doubt the kid fell asleep,he most definitely did but I'm saying he experienced something akin that happened to me.Totally different things of differing degree's but I say the cause is the same and is founded in our neural network,our CNS,maybe firing off,singals crossed,I don't know I'm not a neuro surgeon,but I think many paranormal phenomena that we experience through our senses (asleep or awake)have internal and not external metaphysical causes.

What do you think Kyphi?

post or telepathy,both are good.

[Guest Rex Mundi]

Man I wish I could. In my circmstances I wish I could, tried. I have no ability. Read tons on it, most are taking the pish. But one or two seem to be genuine.

You and me both, and I reached the same conclusion as you.

[Guest Rex Mundi]

and i felt myself SNAP back to normal awareness with a huge jolt like i had been electrocuted. this is a very strange feeling because immediately afterwards it felt like i was on the very edge of remembering something very deep and primordial. completely unique feeling

This I recognise....

a few times, some years ago mind, I have been in that half asleep stage in my bed, I'm lying on my left side, when I suddenly notice that I have "rotated" out of my body, like I've swiveled about my left shoulder, it is still connected, but the rest of me is hanging over the side of the bed looking down, and as soon as I realise then SNAP I feel myself immediately rotate back in, a massive BANG like an AC current noise in my head, but no pain or anything, just a THUD that I feel but I don't feel physically, just like it was my nervous system slamming back into place.

and I'm pissed of, if only I did not notice then perhaps I would have continued, but it always catches me by surprise so I can't not notice it.

It's like Douglas Adams explanation of how to fly, you just throw yourself at the ground and miss. But you can only do that by not thinking about the ground you are about to hit, and when you miss the ground you must not notice this as a fact.