ecothrive coco lite vs coco clay for drain to waste?

[Tsoi]

 

 

Thinking of running blumat drippers and getting floraflex platforms to drain to waste to a waste resevoir

 

Is there any benefits to using coco clay over coco lite or are they pretty much the same thing? I would assume there would be an increase in yield as there are more air pockets and overall less "soil-like" qualities as it would hold less water

 

Also can I still use blumats in a coco clay medium or will I have to use drippers? I assume I could just leave the top few inches with pure coco and stick the blumat into that.

 

I get that i would have to also run drippers more frequently, but it wont be much of a problem to me as its gonna be automated anyway

 

(The website went under maintenance when i posted this a few days or so so sorry if duplicate post)

Edited August 22, 2022 by Tsoi
more info

[sweettooth]

the coco/clay is 40/60  (40% coco) compared to the lite @ 70/30 (70% coco), either one you'll be better off running drippers and the more air you have the more frequent you will have to fertigate.

 

I think the coco clay is more sorted to a recirculating system rather than RTW as you would be watering lots and wasting a lot of nutrient solution

 

unsure your pot size,  but you'll want 2 blue flood drippers per pot, other drippers and system are available, only saying blues as that's what I use, great saturation of a 5l coco pot in less than 2 minutes.

 

Ive tried the 70/30 and pure coco, honestly, I prefer pure coco, works great in a RTW, unsure id go 60/40

 

 

Edited August 22, 2022 by sweettooth

[Tsoi]

3 hours ago, mikeydoughnut said:

I believe the blumats are a no no in coco. I can’t remember where but I think someone might have tried it. I’m sure I saw it on here. Coco needs saturating really and the blumats won’t do that. I have a set myself and want to automate watering but I doubt they’d be any good. Truly awesome in compost. Produced my best compo plant by far. But my experience with them is that it wouldn’t provide enough drink unless you had them cranked right open to give them a soak then turned them back down and reset them. May aswell hand water than do that, infact I reckon you’d have to hand water to prevent salt build up n that. 
Sorry for the long answer  

 

I help my boy out whos running 75% 70/30 coco and 25% H&G batmix. works very well and gets a good amount of runoff. Only problem is that once you have it set to runoff a little bit it will constantly saturate it, which ended up oversaturating the soil in the mix which slowed them down a lot. Turned it down to where the bottom of the pot its bone dry but the soil is still moist a few inches down. Plants couldnt be happier. 

 

Now as far as i know, once a week he turns them down a few clicks just before bed, and turns them back to the original when he wakes up just so he can get that runoff going.

 

Ill be honest never tried it on pure coco, but surely cant be much of a difference?

[Tsoi]

4 hours ago, sweettooth said:

the coco/clay is 40/60  (40% coco) compared to the lite @ 70/30 (70% coco), either one you'll be better off running drippers and the more air you have the more frequent you will have to fertigate.

 

I think the coco clay is more sorted to a recirculating system rather than RTW as you would be watering lots and wasting a lot of nutrient solution

 

unsure your pot size,  but you'll want 2 blue flood drippers per pot, other drippers and system are available, only saying blues as that's what I use, great saturation of a 5l coco pot in less than 2 minutes.

 

Ive tried the 70/30 and pure coco, honestly, I prefer pure coco, works great in a RTW, unsure id go 60/40

 

 

By blue flood drippers you mean the blusoaks? (link below) or blue-coloured drippers

 

https://www.ecothrive.co.uk/catalogue/blusoak-kits_136/

 

never ran pure coco just coco/soil mixes. Can I throw as much water as I want and it will still not overwater even with pure coco ? (within reason) Just need some confirmation before i get too excited with it. 

 

im thinking of doing 5-8 plants in a 1x1 meter from clone. Honestly I have no fucking clue as I havent gotten round to it  got any recommendations? Im thinking about 30 or so liters for final pots?

 

 

[Tsoi]

2 minutes ago, mikeydoughnut said:

In my mind you’d have to saturate it everyday to prevent salt build up. If I’m right in my thinking coco likes to rob cal/mag (not sure if it’s both or one or t’other) but I reckon the slow nature of blumats your coco would rob the mineral before the plant can have it. As I say I’m no expert it’s just me making assumptions. All I can say is just try, I can’t afford to miss a harvest so I’m not prepared to fuck things up in the name of research like. Good luck  

 

its both calmag, however if its properly buffered it generally isnt an issue, though you can just top up a little bit of calmag to the resevoir and youre golden.

 

thanks, im deffo open to new ideas and havent sunk the money in yet so Ill deffo consider drippers. I assume you can water coco as much as you like? You just need to fine tune them with the timer so they run off 10-20%, its less about overwatering the plants and more about refilling the resevoir every few days  .

 

and I assume. its more of an art than a science, just fine tuning the duration, correct me if im wrong  

[JonDaMon]

25 minutes ago, Tsoi said:

 

its both calmag, however if its properly buffered it generally isnt an issue, though you can just top up a little bit of calmag to the resevoir and youre golden.

 

thanks, im deffo open to new ideas and havent sunk the money in yet so Ill deffo consider drippers. I assume you can water coco as much as you like? You just need to fine tune them with the timer so they run off 10-20%, its less about overwatering the plants and more about refilling the resevoir every few days  .

 

and I assume. its more of an art than a science, just fine tuning the duration, correct me if im wrong  

 

I have a coco DTW (drain to waste) setup and I’ve been using coco for 13 years. 
 

coco holds on to Ca and delivers back K over time which is why feeding to runoff is best for newbies as it keeps it correct in the coco. 
 

BLUMATS require lower EC feeding to be done correctly. 

 

BLUMATS can be used with coco, plenty of people in the USA use them and the “other” site I came from had plenty of USA BLUMAT users. 
 

You need to fine tune them obvisouly which can see your high suspended reservoir dump when you have a runaway that’s why I like a reservoir low and a pump to deliver to the plants. 
 

 

my setup is really simple. 
 

 

use something to lift your plants up off the floor and have a catch pan underneath the plants. 
 

 

use a reservoir big enough for your needs. I feed 2 plants approx 2-4 times a day in 11L pots for 1 minute each feed. 
 

i utilise a pump, 13mm delivery ring, 4x4mm feeders to each pot and a timer capable of running in minutes. (Home bargains has a great Daewoo one for £6)

 

i keep a wave maker in my reservoir on 24h a day to keep it agitated and mixed. 
 

I also have things like back pressure release valve and supply ring cut off valve etc along with an inline filter that I use as a quick release coupler. 

 

If you want to ask anything specific I will answer as best I can for you. 
 

 

[sweettooth]

2 hours ago, Tsoi said:

By blue flood drippers you mean the blusoaks? (link below) or blue-coloured drippers

 

https://www.ecothrive.co.uk/catalogue/blusoak-kits_136/

 

never ran pure coco just coco/soil mixes. Can I throw as much water as I want and it will still not overwater even with pure coco ? (within reason) Just need some confirmation before i get too excited with it. 

 

im thinking of doing 5-8 plants in a 1x1 meter from clone. Honestly I have no fucking clue as I havent gotten round to it  got any recommendations? Im thinking about 30 or so liters for final pots?

 

 

no, they are blue flood drippers - google them and youll see them.

Im just moving on to 70/30 eco thrive as my local store is out of canna pro (plus ecothrive is cheaper and lighter)

 

Running RTW from a 250 litre res using timer for multiple feeds a day

 

u wont need 30 litre pots, I use 5 litres and average 1.4 gpw

 

Yes you cant over water coco but you also can (if you get me)...... root development is key to a good yield and keeping pots saturated wont make those roots grow and can also cause other issues, start off watering light, use dry backs, keep a n eye on pot weighty and slowly increase the amount of watering's

Edited August 22, 2022 by sweettooth

[Tsoi]

On 22/08/2022 at 5:03 PM, sweettooth said:

no, they are blue flood drippers - google them and youll see them.

Im just moving on to 70/30 eco thrive as my local store is out of canna pro (plus ecothrive is cheaper and lighter)

 

Running RTW from a 250 litre res using timer for multiple feeds a day

 

u wont need 30 litre pots, I use 5 litres and average 1.4 gpw

 

Yes you cant over water coco but you also can (if you get me)...... root development is key to a good yield and keeping pots saturated wont make those roots grow and can also cause other issues, start off watering light, use dry backs, keep a n eye on pot weighty and slowly increase the amount of watering's

 

thanks for the clarification.

1.4 gpw  what light and tent do you use then. very impressive. Would check your other posts but for some reason i cant load any profiles without getting error 500

 

also only 5 liter pots? How big do you expect the plants to be then?

 

I guess its different with soil and organics, but i always thought the general consensus was to start in small pots, then transplant to pots as big as possible, as bigger pots mean more space for roots, therefore increasing the size of the plant. 

[JonDaMon]

2 hours ago, Tsoi said:

 

thanks for the clarification.

1.4 gpw  what light and tent do you use then. very impressive. Would check your other posts but for some reason i cant load any profiles without getting error 500

 

also only 5 liter pots? How big do you expect the plants to be then?

 

I guess its different with soil and organics, but i always thought the general consensus was to start in small pots, then transplant to pots as big as possible, as bigger pots mean more space for roots, therefore increasing the size of the plant. 

 

with coco as your medium you treat it like hydro. 
 

 

this was with a 7Litre pot in a 3x3 SCROG frame fed every 2 hours under 300w of LED Dinafem critical plus. Approx 15oz on that plant. 
 

this was the above plant you can see the pot size   

 

 

 

 

Keep EC low (generally I’m under 1.5EC with 0.2 source water) if you notice any issues start by increasing the amount of daily feeds. 
 

 

if you feel coco is too wet (which isn’t very often) then increase EC. 
 

 

in 13 years of coco growing I can count on 1 hand the amount of times I’ve used an EC higher than 1.5EC. 

 

 

[sweettooth]

4 hours ago, Tsoi said:

 

thanks for the clarification.

1.4 gpw  what light and tent do you use then. very impressive. Would check your other posts but for some reason i cant load any profiles without getting error 500

 

also only 5 liter pots? How big do you expect the plants to be then?

 

I guess its different with soil and organics, but i always thought the general consensus was to start in small pots, then transplant to pots as big as possible, as bigger pots mean more space for roots, therefore increasing the size of the plant. 

1.5 x 3m tent

2 x leds (1 x 600 & 1 x 1050)

plants range from scrogged to 1.7m tall. smaller pots in coco mean more frequent waterings so nutes are always available. I always use the rule of thumb - how long are you intending to veg for?? If your growing mammoth plants than yes pot size is required but i veg for 6 weeks and then flip so i get a crop every 9 weeks, i dont have the time to fill out large pots

[BushDoctoR]

On 22/08/2022 at 2:58 PM, Tsoi said:

im thinking of doing 5-8 plants in a 1x1 meter from clone. Honestly I have no fucking clue as I havent gotten round to it  got any recommendations? Im thinking about 30 or so liters for final pots?

 

 

30L is way too big. As a general rule of thumb I'd say you want somewhere between 25-40L total medium per sqM, split among the plants. I have 9 in a 1m x 1.2m space and they're in 3.8L pots and they could and probably will end up in smaller pots in future.

 

Blue flood drippers are also known as wilma drippers. I never looked back once I switched to those

 

Feed times aren't that complicated. As long as you're getting a good amount of runoff and they aren't drying out too much in-between feeds then you'll be on the right track. The only fine tuning with the dialling in I do is trying to find the perfect balance between getting enough runoff without wasting too much which is difficult as my waste is pumped directly to the drain and struggle to measure the run off volume