Old timer vs notill living soil,Gram per watt and other thoughts

[Dont Panic its Organic]

So I'm considering taking the leap from plant magic soil supreme and oldtimer, to living soil with blumats.

 

A big concern of mine is the GPW though. I've been getting 0.85 - 1 GPW for a while now on average depending on strain.

 

Has anyone else taken the leap from oldtimer or BioBizz and lived to tell the tale?

 

I'm thinking of using a recipe from buildasoil, and including some frass and bio char, and including a cover crop. Open to an and all suggestions for recipes, sourcing products etc.

 

I do a 4x8 tent with 12 5 gallon pots. 1 plant each. Considering 15 gallon pots x 8 with up to 2 plants in each, ideally 1 but if I have 2 half sized plants at transplanting time I might give it a go.

 

That being the case I'll need to fill 8 15 gallon pots so approx 450L of soil. might even double it and do some outdoor containers for a veg garden.

[craigfjyp]

hey bud,

 

i don't know nothing about notill myself but there is a few growers on this site, here's a link to one diary but if you look you'll find others....

 

 

[blackpoolbouncer]

 

This was an auto, wasn't on blumats which I am now but a good soil on its own can go a long way. 

 

Plain water from day one to finish. No other inputs 

 

Can be done dude. If your going down the no till route and plan on successive grows then I'd have a read around. A few of us have been at it a while.

[Bubbles Depot]

I'd go for 20 gallon pots or bigger if practical. 15s are doable but the more soil you have the easier it is to keep everything in balance. 

[Sargares]

Going for virtually exactly the same set up you're going for after I've picked out a keeper in my next grow. I'm going for a low stretch strain and leds to preserve headroom then going for 15gallons I think. The 20s are just a little large unless I really cram em in. 

 

I'm going to use a lower organic matter coots mix as I think the 33% is a disaster waiting to happen unless you have voodoo vermi.

 

5 gallons I don't think will have the volume to keep up without liquid feeding. 

[muffintop]

Don't go mad on sourcing everything under the sun, it'll cost you a small fortune. I've been doing no-till for a while now and it can be done using very little money, I'm still using the same amendments I purchased years ago when I built the soil. Neem, seaweed/calcified seaweed, malted barley, rock dust, gypsum, comfrey, ecothrive and EWC is all I top dress now.

Edited March 11, 2019 by muffintop

[trance]

Hey,

 

My first try at 'no liquid feed' soil I used 20 litre pots. I had to start liquid feeding at beginning of week 6. Not too bad, but short non the less. Reckon you would need 30 ltrs min. Again this would depend on your mix and top dressing etc...

I tried the sub cool super soil to dip the toes, but I wouldn't use that mix again without a good few amendments. 

You live and learn.

For me, getting a mix that has plenty mag would help no end, my water is super soft. Mag shortage at 5th week with the supesoil mix!

 

Good luck

[FARMER G]

Just completed a cycle in organic soil with water from start to finish ( i was in small pots so had to supplement a handful of times after stretch to replenish the N with fishmix but other than that water from start to finish)  i was supposed to use larger pots but i will next time.

 

Flower is 100% clean organic magic !

 

I take it you want to go down the organic as possible route which in turn will effect your GPW to start with imo until you get things dialed in....

 

Quality over quantity any day 

 

Farmer G 

[Jimboo]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

9

Just now, FARMER G said:

Just completed a cycle in organic soil with water from start to finish ( i was in small pots so had to supplement a handful of times after stretch to replenish the N with fishmix but other than that water from start to finish)  i was supposed to use larger pots but i will next time.

 

Flower is 100% clean organic magic !

 

I take it you want to go down the organic as possible route which in turn will effect your GPW to start with imo until you get things dialed in....

 

Quality over quantity any day 

 

Farmer G 

What size of pots mate?

[Lennon]

Just now, FARMER G said:

Quality over quantity any day 

 

 

Absolutely

[FARMER G]

6.5ltr`s mate so was small for this method of growing , i was told off the bat from the guys who make the soil that they would struggle after stretch if i didnt supplement because of the small boots but i only feed a handful of times any case and they went straight through fading naturally till the end  

 

Farmer G 

[Guest]

Hi mate ive currently made a new batch as per below.Much better than my previous mix I bought elsewhere.Im pretty sure the mixed notill soil I initially bought, out of laziness had coco instead of sphagnum peat moss.

100 litres of Irish moss peat £4

120 litres EWC £40

2 x 16 litre buckets of biochar granules. £30

Rock dust 5 litres £10.

 

So for less than £100 over 200 litres of your own mixed soil that you know is the right weight and mix etc.

 

Not such a mind bending array of amendments and holds water very well compared to a lot of recipes.

 

Its from a fella called Mountainorganics.Or bluejay  as he was known elsewhere.An absolute legend with the no till.

 

50% Sphagnum Peat Moss

40% Humus

10% Biochar

8 cups per cuF Rock Dust

(Handful of worms per pot/bed)

 

50% Sphagnum Peat Moss:

 

 (Alternatively, coco coir amended with 1/2 cup gypsum per cuF to account for the absence of Sulphur).  Coir has a lower CEC, is devoid of life, and of course utterly lacking in Sulphur.  It is inherently inferior to sphagnum peat moss at face value but in taking the appropriate actions as noted above and proper long term soil care, this fact is of little consequence.

 

Sphagnum peat moss not only contains nutrients but is also full of bacterial and fungal life including mycorrhizae.

 

40% Humus:

 

This can be in the form of Thermophilic compost, worm castings/vermicompost or leaf mould.  Sourcing quality humus is key to growing vigorous and healthy plants from the beginning.  A favorite variation on this portion is to use existing well used ‘notill soil’ which over the course of a few to several years literally becomes pure worm castings!

 

10% Biochar

 

Biochar has a laundry list of benefits and will have an article all to itself in the future.   Again, source quality char made properly via pyrolysis and for general agricultural purposes it should be made in the 250C-400C temperature range. Biochar retains 10-12 times its weight in water (think: drought tolerance), stimulates microbial growth and diversity in the all important rhizosphere (increased yields), acts as a ‘reservoir’ for nutrients thus reducing ongoing fertilizer requirements.  Incredibly porous increasing Oxygen content in the soil, and of course sequesters carbon.

 

8 cups Rock Dust per cuF

 

Per cuF of the above base soil mix we then add 8 cups of volcanic rock dust (basalt, granite). Rocks and their eventual dissolution (hence, ‘rock dust’) is the original source of ALL nutrition on earth, minerals!  Aside from the fact your compost/humus portion is indeed loaded with nutrients the rock dust is your ultimate source of nutrition / minerals and via the approach of NoTill Gardening you will never need to re-amend this soil! NEVER!

 

I like to use this phrase to most simply sum up why this basic soil mix covers all your bases: “Rock dust is the source of nutrients, Humus is the delivery system.” Soil life feeds off the rock dust and in turn makes it plant available.  The closer your source of rock dust is to the consistency of powdered sugar the quicker they become available (from day one in that case).   Through the exchange of plant root exudates the microbes living in the rhizosphere are able to deliver the elemental minerals derived from the rock dust directly into your plants.  

 

Edited April 28, 2019 by icki

[blackpoolbouncer]

That's some expensive bloody compost!

 

Id cry mixing up a few cubic meters of that. Jesus

[Guest]

 I thought it was cheap.

 

I suppose coming from coco not buying A and B etc its been cheap as for me.

 

 

[Sargares]

Try knocking up a few hundred litres of coots mix in the UK. Need to remortgage! Especially if you buy the worm castings.