Guest nigfis Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 I agree with OT1, I’ve been a greenhouse gardener for …. Ummm…. Let’s say a fair few years, growing mainly Cacti and other plants that couldn’t survive in our short summers. When I started I was determined to do it all organically, but it didn’t take long to realize that what I had created in the greenhouse was a microclimate that really had little to do with the environment outside. When pests get in they don’t behave like they do outside, no cold, wet days and nights to slow the breeding and eating cycles. They positively bloom in there. See a couple of whitefly in there one day and you can bet your ass that if you do nothing there and then, the next time you walk in you’ll be greeted by a veritable blizzard of the little buggers. This, in my experience, goes for just about any pest that finds it’s way into your grow-room or veg box. Even worse, in the greenhouse things at least slow down over winter, we don’t have winters in growrooms. Optimum breeding conditions all year round, with better egg-hatching conditions than if you’d put them under a broody chicken. The amount of treatments that have to be given when controlling a pest outbreak ‘organically’ seems, to me at least, far more damaging than the ‘spot it, nuke it and the growroom’ approach in an unnatural environment. As an aside. I am presently trying BioBizz’s new formula Buzz-Off, but at the first sign that it’s not actually killing them and breaking the life-cycle, they are getting Torq’ed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad (the impala) Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 accepting the fact that it is extraordinarily difficult to make (and keep) a growroom sterile, and that many people's setups are far short of ideal, I've tried to take a pragmatic view - I've had (pretty past-tense) mites in the past, I'll probably get them again, but I really will try to avoid anything like these synthetics - it IS possible to do without - even using a plant-oil based spray, I would never use it on the plant after 12/12 commences. I'm an avid listener to the gardening programmes, and the usual attitude taken by organic gardeners is that its a matter of balance - they accept that they'll never eradicate pests completely, and it would be wrong to do so, and work to improve the vitality of their crops so that they can withstand the onslaught of pests and predators, and use "natural" control methods. To anyone with a conventional schooling in horticulture, my attitude would probably make them faint......I accept that my growing is an extension of my home and garden, and not in the least sterile, and accept that things will migrate in and out, and rely instead on good healthy plants, and a wary eye!.........so far, its worked! On this growroom sterility thing- surely to achieve sterility, you have to go to enormous lengths? - air locks etc.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer1 Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 i mentioned dynamec as a last resort a few weeks ago and was slapped down by one of the mods but all i said was that if av used evrythin else then its got to b a good thing to get rid of the bugs with this product cos it works. 251908[/snapback] Abermectin is cultured from a fungus strain originally found on a golf course, it is the best tool for eradication in the uk at this moment! It should not be used as a control, as mites will gain resistance to it if its used in this way. This forum is about pest control, I think the control is the wrong word for pernicious pests like thrips and mites. By allowing them to breed and survive in our growrooms while tinkering with control chemicals, Over the generations we are fast track mutating them to our environment and the chems we are using, in California for instance neem oil actually now enhances one strain of two spot mites immune system instead of killing them. There are mites that have altered trachea that cope with oil or starch suspensions. Its not the products fault, its the bad practises used by growers, that provide the survivel adaptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad (the impala) Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 at risk of sounding pedantic, surely eradication is impossible.........? red spider mite abounds in nature, and if it gets in once, will get back in again when the poisons have dispersed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer1 Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 Vlad You have a box, air in and air out, for pests it is simple to screen your input air.. Then as long as you take a little care not to introduce any pests with infested material it will remain clear of them forever. In nigfis’s case there is no way of keeping a glass house clear of pests, the only way is control, in this case I would go for knockdown control ie oil or soft soap early in the season followed by predators. This is a very different scenario to a grow cabinet/room where you have total control... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad (the impala) Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 the problem comes when the grow box has its doors regularly opened, and a fan blown in for a "treat"..........and the window to outside is open into the room in which it stands! control? - me? - doesn't compute! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer1 Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 you are just making excuses now, you can screen a window as well you know! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RAZ Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 So what about this "torq", i've heard a few peeps mention this stuff now. RAZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer1 Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 RAZ not sure I would recommend torq, it is an old acaricide pretty much specific to spider mite, active ingredient fenbutatin oxide. It was never tested like chemicals are nowdays and been mainly replaced with more modern acaricides but you can still get it. But abermectin [Dynamec] is a much safer product and more effective. You can find PDF data sheets for both here! Edited to add:- Sorry its got frames you need to click the Insect./Acaricides link Or to see the page out of the frame here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad (the impala) Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 I'm just off to the growbox my dear..........don't wait up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer1 Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 isnt torq very dangerous if you dont know how to apply it? 251982[/snapback] Yep torq is potentially very dangerous! All active insecticides are potentially dangerous to the operator, commercial one even more so. You need to read the data sheets, have protective clothing respirator etc. I hope people realise that from what I already posted. I was hoping that people would look into risks before doing anything after reading this thread. I know people don’t in general, if they did things like vapona insecticide slow release strips would not have been on the market for 20 odd years, millions a year and still on the market in most of the world . How did/does anyone who use/d them think they worked? There it was a little vented box that once opened to the air killed any insect that came in the room for 3 months. I have seen them in food shops, kitchens, bedrooms including childrens, in pet baskets, chicken houses and far the worst grow rooms.. Its unbelievable. I have seen posts on other cannabis sites telling its members to use Provado to water their plants to keep them pest free. One application lasts for up to 3 months. If it makes the whole plant so toxic that any critter that bites it will die after all that time, is it good to smoke? Enough Ot blathering for the day I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VRG Posted October 25, 2004 Share Posted October 25, 2004 The best thing at this moment in time to get a complete kill is Dynamec, this contains abermectin. It is not licensed for public use but some growshops sell it in small doses. Two or better three sprays 7 days apart should totally eradicate all current mite strains. Only ever needed to spray the once! Dynamec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RAZ Posted October 25, 2004 Share Posted October 25, 2004 Where can I obtain Dynamec? RAZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VRG Posted October 25, 2004 Share Posted October 25, 2004 Where can I obtain Dynamec? You need a sprayers license RAZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RAZ Posted October 25, 2004 Share Posted October 25, 2004 Not much point in saying that's whats needed then eh .... RAZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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