Synthetic Variety? (s.v.)

[S.K.]

In the description for Cream Caramel (see sweetseeds strain guide) it says CC is a synthetic variety (S.V.)

I dont really know what this means and was wondering if you could give some more information about synthetic (S.V.) strains?

Muchas gracias,

SK

[groovelick]

If i remember rightly dont quote me on it but it has something to do with 3 way cross rather than 2 way cross I think something gets lost in the translation from spanish to English

[S.K.]

If i remember rightly dont quote me on it but it has something to do with 3 way cross rather than 2 way cross I think something gets lost in the translation from spanish to English

Cheers for that groove but I dont think its the language barrier this time mate ....In the strain guide it says...

"The synthetic varieties share with hybridised varieties an objective to obtain the vigour of a hybrid and to give homogeneity to its descendents"

It sounds like a different way or method of creating a multi-hybrid as it compares a synthetic variety to hybridised strains.

Was just looking to find out a bit more about this if possible.

SK

Edited September 1, 2009 by S.K.

[Solidopc]

Hey dude, my friend grew this strain out. Was just looking through his diary somewhere else, but couldn't find where he told what he had found out about just what you asked.

He emailed the breeder, and from what i can remember, the synthetic bit is meant to describe the way the cross was done. As someone mentioned above, it is a 3-way cross. In other words, pollen from 3 donos was mixed and then used to pollenate a female. So you have a choice of 3 different crosses in the one cross. I can remember two of the the pollen donors were maple leaf indica and east indian blueback, or something like that. The ch9 flower, and near all ch9 strains are made this way. I've found it to be quite good in producing some good selections in a small number of seeds.

Hope this helps. Peace.

[S.K.]

The thing is, I have always known all 3 way crosses to be called hybridised strains as per usual..

Another thing is that I always understood that pollinating females in that way would result in the offspring displaying mutiple phenotypes due to the large mix of genetics used? But in the description for Cream Caramel it says "The synthetic varieties share with hybridised varieties an objective to obtain the vigour of a hybrid and to give homogeneity to its descendents"

To achieve homogeneity I would have thought that backcrossing and inbreeding would be the only way to create uniform offspring further down the line?

[Solidopc]

I'm no breeder man. I pretty much thought the exact same thing as yourself, that back crossing was the best way to stabilise favourable traits in a variety.

But here in these 3 way crosses, i believe that isn't the goal. From all the ch9 stuff i've grown, i can say, that all phenotype variation, is favourable, and i think that is what is being sought after. Not, that you can buy 10 seeds that produce females that are all very similar, but that 10 seeds will produce 10 good females, all different. Some might be similar in some ways, if they share the same pollen donor, but they are all different, but at the sametime good. So you get alot of variety from the pack, and can choose a unique female to suit your own preferences, or just get good variety from a single pack of seeds, which all flower at roughly the same rate, but will have some major differences in taste/aroma/high etc.

I do not know if this is what they are trying to do. It is what i believe, or guess they are, from my own experience of growing these kinds of seeds, and seeing the results.

[S.K.]

I get what ur saying, but in the description it says the offspring should be homogeneous not that multiple pheno's should/will show through....

I'm just curious thats all....

SK

[Solidopc]

All good dude, no worries, just some random shit floating about in my head is all. . Would be interesting to find out what the man himself has to say. /Carlos enter stage left.... peace and repsect.

[S.K.]

Carlos/sweetseeds if you guys could give any further information on this it would be well appreciated.

[Sweet Seeds-tommy]

Hi Uk420 Friends !

Sorry for our translation from spanish but the english isn´t our native language.

Obtaining synthetic varieties is a classic method applicable to improving allogamous species or partially allogamous species, like the cannabis case.

This kind of cultivars are knowed in genetic terminology like Synthetic Varieties (S.V.).

Cream Caramel is the result of the balanced mix of three of our best indicas varieties. Chosen for his excellent agronomics qualities like production, kind and intensity of aromas, kind and intensity of high, amount of trichomes, diseases resistence, plant structure, flowering short times, null hermaphroditism tendency and specially response its favorable to form good hybrids.

For the cream caramel creation we have used three founder lines, a hybrid blueblack (Blueberry 99 x Black Domina 98) of I+D sweet seeds departament, a excellent indica Maple Leaf of wonderfull afgan genetic and a medicinal White Rhino. With this three parental lines we form a balanced population, composed for the same number of individues of each of this parental lines.

This plants group was isolated in three different spaces. Avoiding selfed and to favor the cross-pollination taking full advantage of heterosis or hybrid vigor. So each lines we crossed freely only with the another two.

We harvested and mixed in the same number the seeds of this first generation obtained of the three spaces of pollination, it forms a generation SV1 with all the hybrid combinations possible of the founder lines. This generation, as well, we leave it in free pollination resulting a cross in all the ways of all hybrids combinations possible ( SV2 ).

The seeds of the SV2 generation forms of the three lines parental gametes cross totally shuffled. This population is a panmictic population, balanced, and all the next generations would be identical in free pollination and absence selection, then gene frecuences are costant.

In the next generations until SV5 applied recurrent selection, choosing numbers enough big of parental that showed interest agronomic caracters for form the next generation, instead leave the totally random proccess.

Cream Caramel is a SV that share with hybrid varieties the objective of take the hybrid vigor and bring uniformity to the offspring. In adittion have been fixed by selection in some generations the most desirable features. S.V. dont reach a degree of stability higher like the F1 but his great bandwith make very flexible and adaptable in unfavorable conditions and environmental hazards.

We hope help you and to have clarified some doubts and questions.

Greetings,thanks a lot !

Sweet Seeds staff.

[S.K.]

Wow, thanks a lot sweetseeds for sharing that information! I pretty much understand the process now, might need to google a word or two just to clarify a bit but thanks for taking the time to answer. I'm also glad to know more about the BlueBlack genetic as I had not heard of this strain before, the more I learn about the CC the more my mouth waters!

Sounds like a great way of creating strains, I'm now even more exited about growing this strain if that was ever possible! I can tell a lot of time and dedicated work have gone into creating the Caramel. From what I understand the CC contains equal amounts of each genetic used in its creation and that's pretty damn impressive in my opinion!

It sounds like the Cream Caramel also has some very desirable traits like being disease resistant and having no tendency to turn hermaphridite. So far my 3 ladies are all vey uniform and are growing very strong and healthy, Hats off to sweetseeds for creating this strain and giving us the chance to grow it out.

Thanks again for taking the time to explain that, we sure cant wait to sample some fine Caramel flowers!!

S.K

Edited September 15, 2009 by S.K.

[Solidopc]

If i am understanding correctly, do you mean, you take rooms full of each of the three plants used, and cross each of them with the other two plants pollen. Then you mix the seed up, so you have every possible cross possible with these three plants, and that is the S.V1 population?

Really interesting stuff. Still not sure i understand it fully, or even correctly, but thanks for trying to explain even though English isn't your first language.

[S.K.]

I think that's it Solid then I think the S.V1 are all left to freely pollinate each other giving the S.V2 line which are totally mixed up genes of the 3 strains.

After S.V2 I believe thats when selection of certain characteristics and specific crossings come into play until S.V5 is reached.

I could be wrong but that's pretty much what I understood from Sweetseeds reply

Either way its all very interesting stuff, its always good to know as much as possible about the strains we grow and its not too often we get so many details on our genetics.

Top stuff Sweetseeds!!