Hir Posted December 14, 2019 Share Posted December 14, 2019 Animated version. Got shown this at school by a progressive head master. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy2Hats Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 On 14/12/2019 at 11:08 AM, Hir said: Animated version. Got shown this at school by a progressive head Actually not so progressive...This is the version the CIA funded to use as Cold War propaganda.. https://dangerousminds.net/comments/the_cia_funded_the_famous_animated_film_of_orwells_animal_farm1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hir Posted December 30, 2019 Author Share Posted December 30, 2019 (edited) @Billy2Hats It's Orwell's story, exactly as he wrote it nothing is changed, I don't care who funded it, as a 15 year old I took the socialist message even though I wouldn't have verbalized it in that way right after I initially saw it. How did this version betray Orwell's story? Edited December 30, 2019 by Hir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy2Hats Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Hir said: How did this version betray Orwell's story? You didn't notice the absence of humans at the end of the cartoon? It kinda misses the whole point of the book.. Edited December 30, 2019 by Billy2Hats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hir Posted December 30, 2019 Author Share Posted December 30, 2019 The new leaders, they are the same as the old bosses is the message. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hir Posted December 30, 2019 Author Share Posted December 30, 2019 (edited) Orwell didn't like how Stalin corrupted Russian socialism Edited December 30, 2019 by Hir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy2Hats Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, Hir said: The new leaders, they are the same as the old bosses is the message. Perhaps in the book...but the absence of humans at the movie's end detracts from this key point and instead substitutes it with the faux happy ending of Napoleon getting overthrown by the rest of the animals...with no indication that this could/would lead to a new tyranny...the point is therefore (deliberately) lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hir Posted December 30, 2019 Author Share Posted December 30, 2019 So the CIA by your estimation failed to make it's point! Not very effective propergander really. All I took from it is, the new leaders will betray the masses. I'm dyslexic and struggle with reading but I have read this book twice, last time was well over 25 years ago so specifics of the book are some what faded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy2Hats Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, Hir said: So the CIA by your estimation failed to make it's point! Yep...they used the book to make their own point...(rather than Orwell's)....you may recall at the end of the book the rest of the animals discover the humans and pigs are literally indistinguishable...and no one gets overthrown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simple Jack Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 19 minutes ago, Hir said: Orwell didn't like how Stalin corrupted Russian socialism He had first hand experience of Stalinism in the Spanish civil war. With the national government abandoned by the west, they only had Stalin to turn to for support. This empowered the authoritarian left who found it more expedient to defeat the libertarian left in its ranks than to fight the authoritarian right military rebellion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simple Jack Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, Billy2Hats said: Yep...they used the book to make their own point.. Which was? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hir Posted December 30, 2019 Author Share Posted December 30, 2019 Just now, Simple Jack said: He had first hand experience of Stalinism in the Spanish civil war. With the national government abandoned by the west, they only had Stalin to turn to for support. This empowered the authoritarian left who found it more expedient to defeat the libertarian left in its ranks than to fight the authoritarian right military rebellion. He was a pragmatist, the West wouldn't support a legitimately elected Parliament so they had no choice but to except Russian hardware. The Parliament was constituted via a coalition of if I remember correctly 17 parties, from middle parties to extreme left, 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yosser Hughes Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 (edited) i dont remember the animal farm i watched was fuk all like this Edited December 30, 2019 by thekingofobsolete keyboards full of ash 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy2Hats Posted December 31, 2019 Share Posted December 31, 2019 8 minutes ago, Simple Jack said: Which was? I would speculate it was trying to re-frame Animal Farm in the context of the 1950s Cold War as a "freedom" vs totalitarianism narrative...tbh (as with most covert operations) I don't think anyone definitively knows...there's some more background here.... https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2003/mar/07/artsfeatures.georgeorwell 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simple Jack Posted December 31, 2019 Share Posted December 31, 2019 5 minutes ago, Hir said: if I remember correctly 17 parties, from middle parties to extreme left But so many different shades of extreme left! The anarcho-syndicalism that took root in Barcelona and surrounding areas rejected both authority and private property. A functional society without bosses or owners could not be seen to succeed. For a brief period it did. This scene from Ken Loach's Land and Freedom sums it up perfectly. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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