Alternatives to politics/ the current use of politics

[WeedIsFree]

I've been thinking recently how politics is, it's like a never ending argument of which party did this or that and claims to solve these past mistakes, followed by a new batch of mistakes and the cycle continues. Two sides constantly arguing with the occasional rise from a fringe group makes it a bit like a football team mentality when people see it as choosing sides and for some people it's a massive thing to change parties after voting for them for a long time. Nothing ever really gets solved, cracks get covered up while most people are generally shafted by the current situation in this country let alone globally. Rich corporations seem to merge with banks and governments and other organisations to make a big melting pot of crap

So anyway what I was thinking is do people here think that if our current political system of parties, voting, national/international control etc would actually work well if the people at the top were not seemingly complete pyschopaths or rich morons or both that were driving the planet to madness?

Or does anyone have an idea of some realistic way of some new system perhaps?

I'd love to go exodus style but cant really see most people being up for turning their backs on everything so is there some balance maybe? Something I thought could be useful would be some sort of rally to grow your own food, ww2 shows that people will do it if they have to even in cities people were growing veg in their gardens, why do we need a war to do it?

Another issue is this thought, as humans although we are intelligent to some degree but we are still a product of this planet, natural, an animal, are we ever going to find some way of regulating ourselves properly without really understanding our relationship to the planet first? I suppose other 'animals' have their own power structures in packs etc but their not affecting the rest of the planet as such so I'll not knock 'em

I'd also advocate personal evolution over nation revoltion as whats the point of more blood shed to end up with yet another load of people trying to claim power and control others. Better use that revoltionary feeling for positive means.

Bit of a ramble but I'm stoned and thinking loads so bad luck

So, other solutions to people arguing about who's right and who's wrong in large numbers, is it possible?

[Glydr]

Not all revolutions have a lot of blood shed, some occur with none at all.

Yes we have our multi-party system here, with them all arguing the toss over this and that, but look at many other countries around the world that don't have a system like ours, see how their people are getting on, many of them have it much worse than us.

Don't expect our politicians to wave a magic wand and make all our lives better, that's not gonna happen only we can make our lives better, the politicians now are just managers/administrators.

Our system is not perfect, it has it's faults but it's probably better than most other systems around the world.

[iky]

erics world

I will give an insight to my personal world society, It may not be perfect.

I do think it will be better than the world that I leave .

Ruling power

My chosen method of government would be a DEMOCRACY, but not the same as any of the so called democracies of today. I believe that none of the current methods of democracy are good enough for Eric's world. All have unacceptable flaws.

In Eric's world I will outline the details of one country, the one where I would like to live.

The other counties may choose the method of their own choice. allowing the development of world societies to function under the cultural choice of other members.

The government will consist of two sections of parliament

First section

A house of democrats

No political parties will be part of this house of democrats

An elected by regional government house of democrats who will by vote within the house of democrats supply a cabinet and a prime minister from members of the house of democrats.

The cabinet will elect the prime minister.

Regional government will be elected by local government councils.

Members promoted to cabinet position will be replaced in the house of democrats by another member supplied by their respective regional government. This will allow the cabinet and the prime minister to devote their attention to one task.

The vacancies left by these promoted regional members will be filled by promoted members of local councils.

The empty council places will be filled by the candidate who came second at the local bye election.

This house of democrats will be elected by and be responsible to regional government.

Regional government members will be elected by and be responsible to local council.

The people will elect the required members to the local council.

Salary and office expenditure will be paid by government.

The house of democrats will NOT set national policy, this will be proposed by regional governments, the task of the members of the house of democrats will be to discuss the policies proposed by regional government and through consensus in the house sanction them into law.

Members the house of democrats will after the election of a cabinet of ministers be divided amongst the ministries and act as junior ministers in that department, assisting that minister of department to fulfil their duty, they will have no constituency duty and will be responsible for national departmental activities.

Regional government will be responsible to local councils, the members of regional government are provided by local council s who will be able to replace them at any time, members of the house of democrats can be replaced by regional government at any time by a majority vote.

The cabinet of the house of democrats can be replaced by the house of democrats and the prime minister can be changed by the cabinet at any time by a majority vote.

Local councils will be responsible to the people and may be taken from office in majority referendum by the people of their constituency.

Second section

A house of representatives

Will consist of an elected by the people House of political parties and independents.

They will sanction the laws implemented by the house of democrats.

Any none agreements /stalemates will be decided in the annual peoples referendum.

This house will be elected at a general election for a five year fixed term.

A referendum of the people by majority is the only way an election can be called before the five year period expires.

The house of representatives will consist of independent and political party candidates, all candidates will receive from government an election allowance for the area they wish to represent.

Party funding will not be available from government, with the exception of a set maximum level of funding for area candidates representing Independent and political parties.

National political party election expenditure will not be paid by government.

Salary and office expenditure for representatives will be paid by government.

Democrats and Independents political parties will have funded by government for constituency offices in every local council area.

Those citizens with problems will be able to put their grievances to the democrats office, if satisfaction is not given then the office of representatives may take up the case , they will have the power to enforce a judicial review of any case if they cannot find solution with the local council or regional government.

There will be one representative member to parliament for every area, with a constituency office to receive any grievance from the people.

The representative's constituency office will liaise with local people/local and regional councils. the member will only attend parliament to debate and vote on laws proposed by the house of democrats. Voting and debate by video link could enable the M.P. to have his home in the constituency.

Proposals for annual consensus form

Do you require local council elections

Do you require a local area election

Do you require national representative elections

Do you require local area representative elections

Regional government stalemates

DO you agree or disagree with the regional policy stalemated, state if you are for the policy proposed or against.

National government stalemates

Do you agree or disagree with the national policy stalemate, state if you are for the policy or against

Any one wishing to take a problem or propose a solution to a problem will contact their local democrat representative at his office, They will take the case to regional level if a solution cannot be found within the local council

If no satisfaction is forthcoming the person will contact their parliamentary representative to take up the case , the representative will have the power to implement a judicial review and determination of the case by law or judicial consensus by a panel of judges on appeal.

MY COUNTRY WILL BE CALLED APEKRIA

A WORD RELEVANT TO MY DREAM WORLD

RULES AND REGULATION

There will be a requirement for rules and regulations to make the democracy efficient.

The most important is a bill of rights for all people.

I have given some basic rules for the operation of my proposed government, changes will be necessary as it develops, This is the basis for democracy that I would choose.

ECONOMY

THE economy of APEKRIA will be the proposed system of flow economics.

Funds supplied by government will fuel all social and ecological requirements .

These funds will eventually be eliminated from the system using a variety of methods.

Full funding for all government departments will be available.

I will develop Apekria as if I were transforming the country where I live (U.K.)

I have selected my method of government all of the other countries in Eric's world will adopt the government of their choice. All would adopt the flow economic system and trade through national and international public owned exchange banks, using their own currencies, giving equality of purchasing power to all member countries.

The ramblings of a stoned uneducated old man or seeds for change??????????

[Randal Graves]

If you want to change politics, you need to change the economic system. Have a look at ParEcon (Participatory Economics) for an interesting and well thought through not-capitalism economic system.

We definitely need to change the way we think about our relationship with nature, and capitalism can only see nature as a resource to make profit from.

Any political system in capitalism will be hampered by this, and the internal logic of capitalism. Representative democracy is about as good as we can get I think.

There are some things we could tinker with round the edges, such as having recall powers or proper PR (not AV) to elect our representatives. I think multi-MP constituencies would be good, 3-5 MPs in each one, which would of course be much larger than the current ones so we end up with the same number of MPs as now. Similar to most councils, but not using first past the post. The advantage of this is that we'd see a lot of constituencies split with say 2 labour, 1 tory, which would give better representation to the toryscum in the constituncy which previously would have returned 3 labour MPs.. same applies in reverse of course.

Replace the HoL with an elected chamber, 12 year terms, fixed elections changing 1/3rd of the house every 4 years. Keep the same powers (can reject legislation from the commons but not actually stop them from being passed into law).

I'd also like to see the government benches seperated from the backbenches, as I would think that none of the cabinet or shadow cabinet get much time for constituency work, at it'd be better to have these people not have a constituency link at all.. it's a different role really.

But whatever you do, we'd still get fucked over by those in power. They'd still represent capital first and foremost, compromising only where forced to, or where the logic of capitalism tells them they should.

Plato nailed it way back when:

Those who want to rule, shouldn't. Those who don't want to rule, should.

The eternal paradox of representative democracy is that only those who want to rule will put themselves forward for the role, and they shouldn't have it.

The answer to this is of course to not have rulers.. direct democracy, anarchism.

[lazi]

For a start, we could make our minds up about whether we are voting for a person or a party. People go to the polls, look at the smaller print to find their preferred party and then place their X. Ask them the name of who they voted for 10 minutes later and most couldn't tell you, unless it's someone well known nationally.

Seems stupid to me that people will put someone in power without caring about the name of that person. My MP enjoys a safe seat yet has never lived here. How about only being eligible to run if you've lived in that constituency for at least 5 years? imo it should be someone that lives in say Lambeth or East Finchley that represents the people of those constituencies, not the lapdog of a political party that has been 'awarded' a safe seat for services rendered to their party.

[Guest grandad]

the only thing that ruins any and all political systems, its simply human beings.

[Greengrocer]

No leaderships, No politics, No borders or countries, No work, No monetary system.. just:

Everyone getting smashed under the stars, and then wake and bake in the sun

[chickenlipsr4]

Surely we've all had enough of self-serving careerists making poor decisions supposedly on our behalf.

I'd like to give some kind of direct democracy a whirl but I realise this also has it's own potential problems. Switzerland have a political system leaning this way and I'm aware an agenda can still be controlled via the way a question is framed, the timing of referenda and obviously with the way corporate media is able to sway or poison debate but it sounds better than our pseudodemocracy.

[Toneblerone]

Seems to me that it wont matter what system is in place to manage a society whilst the individuals in that society are either happy or distracted enough to elect people they dont know to control thier system.How will you ever get fair representation from successful candidates when those candidates are chosen for you?

We entrust government with power of eterny,not just with our wealth but more importantly with our,and our envioroments well being.If these people are not truly caring representatives of these things then they will not be catered for,only that which they do represent will succeed.A career politition surely represents careers,whether that be thier own or others,and careers are indicative of buisness,which in it self does not care for much except profit.This in itself is a contradiction as human resources and the envioroment are,through example not that important if there's profit to be had.It seems enough for most to grumble about the state of our planets affairs based upon how much more some have than others,but if we all gave time to think about only what we need for a healthy survival,buisness and careerists wouldnt rule or be able to make thier way to the for-front of national and global desicion making.I need food,shelter and time to live a natural life,my career is of no use what so ever with out these things,especialy if it robs my decendents of thier chance for a happy existence.I think all that is needed to begin to change the way the world is governed for the better,is for poeple to give some regard to those who follow us rather than who we follow,and to elect localy,to start, our representation accordingly.

OH and Grandad,it's 'humans being' what they're told to be that ruins,but we can change that

[Vicfirth12]

No leaderships, No politics, No borders or countries, No work, No monetary system.. just:

Everyone getting smashed under the stars, and then wake and bake in the sun

This is it. We really don't all the things we have (i would miss loads of things but i don't need them). Hungry? go and find food, its fucking everywhere in this wilderness. Cold? get together and go get some wood. We really only need to survive