How to grow RSC strains

All of the plants in the RSC catalogue are heirloom plants

[edit: so this is the first generation to go into pots, or to go indoors]

1. do not use liquid nutes --- they are too strong for heirloom plants
2. if you want to add more nutrients then pot up into fresh soil in larger pots
3. keep it simple - do not fuck about with sprays, chemicals, or other liquid feeds

other tips

1. find out the meaning of a) heirloom, b. cultivar, c)landrace, d) hybrid

Note

1. None of the cultivars in the RSC catalogue have ever been grown indoors before
2. I repeat: this is the first generation that any of these heirloom lines will have been grown indoors
3. Please try to understand the difference between Dutch/American lines which have had generations of being acclimatised to massive nutrient levels, and heirloom plants like RSC sell
4. Heirloom plants can have way more vigour and way higher yield than Dutch hybrids - even without being fed huge overdoses of fertiliser
5. Heirloom plants do not need excess nutrients!!!!!

Thanks,

Namkha

None of the RSC strains have any heramphroditism

Please see this thread for a full explanation of what hermaphroditism is
http://www.uk420.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=170684
and how to avoid stressing out your plants

OK, for me, the numbnuts (and a potential customer, i might add; been scoping out your catalogue for a while now.).

Can you just go over for me:

With 'regular' plants -
I pot up into their finals, let them fully root. Then put into flower. At some point, after about 3 weeks or so, they run out of nutrients in the pot and need topping up with BioBizz.

With RSC plants -

I'd pot up into their finals, put them into flower and then not need to add any nutrients? Or do you recommend potting up midflower?

Thanks for the gardening help!

basically the nutrient requirements for these plants is very low, but also the vigour and yield is also very high, even without lots of nutes

See this from the Royal Horticultural Society
http://www.uk420.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=181732

I would suggest keeping the pot sizes quite small, until you get to heavy flowering stage

so very small pots for veg
a medium small pot until second week of 12/12
then a nice big pot for full flowering

that's just a suggestion

another suggestion would be to dig in slow release nutes like bonemeal for the flowering medium

but basically most composts will contain all the nutes you are likely to need already

I dont understand what you are saying there mate

Are you saying that these strains can only be grown in compost but with no liquid feed?

Sorry if Ive got this arsehole over shit but surely they are not that special they cant be grown with diluted feed to start and then reading of the plants needs after that?

And does that mean that they cant be grown hydro at all?

Owd

I cant say for sure obviously..but ill bet that alot of strains will show you some male flowers, if you do them in hydro. Thats not a fact, but just my opinion from growing some of these strains.

i have fet 1 lebanese with normal dosage of biobizz grow and bloom, and a little fishmix, wich is all you need imo for healthy plants indoor:) the others lebs have not been getting any biobizz or any other nutes at all, but i just repotted them with fresh soil when needed. the one that was fet biobizz have showed a lot of nanners lately, and the others have not at all, and are more frosty as well.

but as i say..it could be a coincidence, and is just my thougts But i do think its connected as my malanas hated feeding as well

hey Matsi

I'm sure you are being too kind there in saying it might have been a coincidence - I'm sure it was not

n.b.



none of the RSC heirlooms will like lots of quick release N at any growth stage, especially not during flowering - and biobizz bloom still has plenty of N in if I remember right

liquid or not is not the issue --- it's the fact that these feeds are all quick release --- they given a sudden influx of nutes

far as I can see, it's not a bad deal --- you get the same or more yield without the expense and trouble of buying in lots of modern bloom formulas

have a look at how Matsi's Lebanese are filling out - with only compost to feed them

seems like a good deal to me

hehe......i might have been, but i cant base facts on 1 test. i have grown these plants a long time, and i myself are pretty sure about it, but that does not make it a fact

What i took issue with mate is with you saying "do not use liquid nutes"

It made it sound like you can only grow these in compost with no liquid feed, which imo is a bit misleading



Why

Ive not yet come across a plant that cant be grown successfully in hydro

Alert folk to not giving the plants a lot of nutrient yes....and making them aware of overfeeding yes....and giving your own experience with just compost yes....but to make it sound like the plants cant have liquid feed, and they wont grow successfully in hydro is like i said very misleading and i dare say a bit of a put off to some that might want to do just that

Hey i'm not picking on anyone here, just taking issue with what i thought was misleading and incorrect

Owd

I've found all your cultivars so far to grow quite happily without adding any additional nutrients at all and just use plain water throughout the entire grow. The only thing I do add is bonemeal or rock guano to the final flowering compost mix.

hiya Owd - it's not misleading - it's honestly exactly what I meant... excuse the use of bold, but the point really does need the emphasis:





thanks Felix

So you are saying these CANNOT be grown in hydro and you are best using no food when growing in compost?

I'm just trying to get this straight

Owd

well i've got 1 Leb at 8 weeks flower and she's hermied, seeds everywhere,
i think and i say i think cos during a private chat with Matsi last night (cheers m8 )we decided it might have hermied, still unsure as some of the 'seeds' look like calyxes and some look like seeds......none of the other strains in the flower room have hermied or seeded

i roughly followed the BB guide so next one that goes in to flower will be fed on water alone
e2a; nice info but a tad too late

No worries Namkha,

Must say they are some of the easiest plants I've ever grown, the nutrient requirements are almost non existent and they are very resistant to fungal attacks



I would have thought an enterprising grower would be able to work out a very light nutrient regime that would allow them to be grown in hydro, maybe using one of the organic hydro nutes like Biosevia perhaps

Well you chose to only quote a part of what i wrote, and think its misleading...read it agaib owd.

"I cant say for sure obviously..but ill bet that alot of strains will show you some male flowers, if you do them in hydro. Thats not a fact, but just my opinion from growing some of these strains"


so again...what i say is not advise or a fact, nor a conclusion.....just my thoughts.

Matsi, I only asked "why" to the above statement of yours

Ive no need to re-read it mate, i just wanted to know what made you come out with a statement like that

Are we talking all strains or just RCS

How growing any plant in hydro will make it more susceptible to going hermie is what i wanted to know, cos i cant see how?

Have you grown with hydro and had this problem?

Owd

I grow in coco usually, but when i do some of lebs and mazar i got from rsc i will do some in coco and some in compost for a side by side comparison.
I do understand what owd was trying to get across, and i`m sure that they will grow in hydro, but i guess we`re gonna have to be carefull how we feed

r1

I too would like to know, I was considering some RSC seeds, but saw this thread and took it to mean that hydro wouldn't be possible?

I passive hydro in Coco....

So what's the verdict?

Monk...x

And that is exactly what i was getting at and what i took it to read as too

But my question seems to have gone unanswered

Owd

Mono & Owderb

Listen..i do not work for RSC. how you can take what i clearly stated was a thought of mine into something you took as not posible, is beyond me ?? There is nowwhere that i have ever stated that it isnt posible....again...and i quote for you:

"I cant say for sure obviously..but ill bet that alot of strains will show you some male flowers, if you do them in hydro. Thats not a fact, but just my opinion from growing some of these strains"


Owderp:
You did say i was misleading...how can a person mislead others by what is clearly stated as he´s own thoughts ?

My thoughts is only based on the fact that i have noticed that any small change with these plants like temperatur,nutes and choice of soil, seem to affect them to start showing maleflowers. and thats why i think that starting them in hydro would do so too...thats all. like i clearly stated...there is no way in hell to know if its posible before its done...i might be, but i do not think so....thats all


But instead of looking for a reason why i dont think its posible, why dont you try it out, and show us if its posible...i´m sure many, like mono, would love to see and learn from that. if posible..many would be happy i´m sure.

i have only growen 3 strains...malana, lebanese & nepalese...they all seem similar in the way they react to temps, soil and nutes. they seem to like best to just take up there nutes slowly in new soil. liquid nutes seem to stress them and even stall them sometimes.....and thats again...from my experience. as i stated before..its not facts, but thoughts based on what i have already seen with my own plants.

These are outdoor strains, obviously matsi has shown whats possible indoors but taking pristine landrace strains indoors for the first time will no doubt be quite an experimental grow...

Perhaps it would be better to say: Do not add quick release/ high N liquid fertilisers when growing in soil?

I never said you did

I asked why or how you would come to the conclusion that...and i quote



But you didnt answer

And between yourself and Namkha you have confused me and by the looks of the post from mono, you have him also

They maybe "your thoughts"......But i asked what made you come to that conclusion......

So i'll ask again, what made you, and have you witnessed this problem in hydro, in fact have you ever grown hydro

Owd

I currently have Lebanese and Highland Thai (amongst others) in a RDWC. The were gered in paper towels and transfered to rockwool where they vegged in hydroton for 8 weeks with no problems. The lebs seem very hardy and dont mind the liquid nutes at all. The HT's are a little more sensitive but have easily outgrown the non heirloom varieties and are showing flowers before any of the others.
Nutrients used since germination: Advanced Nutrients Sensi grow
Nutrients used since flipping to 12/12 a few days ago: Bud Blood
Next week i'll be switching to Sensi Bloom and big bud, as always starting off with only a fraction of the reccomended doses.

and you see that i have "concluded" that where ?

I did just answer you why i think that in my last post.

No..i have never grown hydro..= hence.....THATS why its a thought, and not a conclusion as you keep insisting that i said, but still cant show me where ? how can you put the word thoughts and conclusion in the same sentence ? have you grown RSC strains in soil or hydro ?

And you dont not answer my quistion...how can you take it as a mislead when it was clearly stating it as a thought of mine ?

you seem to avoid my quistions....why is that ?

Right so I get it....I am easily confused see

They will do best outdoor, in their own environment, natch....

They will do okay outdoor in suitable climate.....

They will do well in pots with compost and very natural, organic, slow release nutes....or better still just potting into new compost...

They CAN be done in compost with liquid feed, but low doses, be careful not to overfeed.....

They MAY do well in hydro systems, but as yet it's untested, advise caution with nute regimes if taking this route.

Is this what you are saying???

Think I might give them a bash once I got these Sweet Seeds out the way...

Monk..x

I think Matsi has now made it clear that his personal experience of growing the 3 strains indicated a high level of sensitivity to horticultural methods alien to the plants natural environment. This led him to draw the (EDIT - "Thoughts") that if he were to grow in hydro he would see a continuation of these problems. Just his personal opinion.

My initial thoughts were that its all a bit of a shame as I am a beginner and they sound like a challenge, but on further reflection, if the seed banks advice is taken it could almost be said they would suit a beginner as if you do as they say, there is less to go wrong.

that's exactly what i am saying (and some of it is what namkha said)

And thats also very close to what i mean...exept i did not come to any conclusion, but only thoughts to myself thinking "if they are this sensible to such small things, i think they would maybe also be sensible to other things than there normal soil"




I have no more to say on subject as i am just trying to help, and asked namkha to make a thread, course i have been reciving quit a lot of PM´s with those quistions And all i can do is give my point of view from my experience. if it does not help those people i am sorry, but not much i can do more than that

English is my 2nd lanquage, and sometimes its not easy to explain what i mean.

Thanks,

I asked you why many posts back and you still havent answered it so dont come back saying i havent answered you

I asked a simple question but you dodged it and you still are doing, you shouldnt come out with such statements without substance, especially one like the one you did, newbies especially would be easily led by that statement and where possible we have to stop that happening

So i'll take it you cant answer my question and i'll leave it there

Owd

Stop what from happening ?....people having speculations and thoughts about subjects that might help others ?

you just keep on going dont you? you seem to be the only one left that havent understood it yet ? i will make it easy for you mate. i will cpoy/paste my answers to your quistion, wich are actely already answered numbers of times:

your quistion that you think i have been dodging:

WHY do i think that hydro will be a problem ? (again..i do not know it...i did not conclude it...i did not state any facts...)

My answer from previously posts:

My thoughts is only based on the fact that i have noticed that any small change with these plants like temperatur,nutes and choice of soil, seem to affect them to start showing maleflowers. and thats why i think that starting them in hydro would do so too...thats all. like i clearly stated...there is no way in hell to know if its posible before its done...i might be, but i do not think so....thats all and

No..i have never grown hydro..= hence.....THATS why its a thought, and not a conclusion as you keep insisting that i said, but still cant show me where ? how can you put the word thoughts and conclusion in the same sentence ? have you grown RSC strains in soil or hydro ?

Now i think you should answer my quistions:

how can you put the word thoughts and conclusion in the same sentence ?

how can a persons thought..not facts...... be misleading when he is not stating a fact ?

Where have i stated a conclusion ?


You getting there ?

i suppose only way to find out if they work in hydro is give them a ago.
but lets face it, any plant can hermie no matter what its grown in.

maybe hydro could make the plant thrive.

Thanks for the info, I recently bought some of your strains + hope to start with them soon.

I was going to buy nutes to use with them but after reading this thread now I think i'll wait until i start my ot seeds.

You say that they are not used to being grown indoors (due to generations in the wild, probably?) so is there anything else you can recommend for me as this is going to be my first grow and all tips are well appreciated.

I was also thinking of using friendly fungi, what do you reckon ?

I was going to use rootriot cubes to start them off in, but as they have nutrients added is this a poor choice?

Is it true that you have to grow out to maturity before taking cuttings if you grow from seed? If so how long are we talking roughly? e.g. with the leb

Would the strain be better if you just grew it to bud from seed or do you think it would adapt better if you went from cuttings to bud?

Oh could you expand on heirloom a little, wiki sucks sometimes but I did learn something new, that a welsh mountain sheep is a landrace.

thanks
cee

Er , what's your 'simple' question Owderb ?

Well if thats the question I suggest you read the response from Matsi !

edit : Or maybe it was this one ?

"So i'll ask again, what made you, and have you witnessed this problem in hydro, in fact have you ever grown hydro"

You can't beat the old Welsh mountain sheep.... Lovely high, unusual taste...

Just to repeat for those that missed it the first time around

I think it is possible to grow several landrace strains like the indica´s if you use e.g. the Advanced Nutrients organic line which is also suitable for hydro, but you have to be carefull with mineralsolutions with a high EC.

Namaste

Matsi, Felix and many others, thank you to all of you for taking the time to handle all that!


---

Now all we need to do is stop the misuse of the word "hermie"

deep breath

for ten points, please describe the difference between

1. an intersex stress response
2. a true hermaphrodite

Well matsi, it made perfect sence to me the first time you said it, maybe saying it 3 times will help those that are a bit slow on the uptake!

All you were giving was your personal opinion on a potenshal problem with growing in hydro, you'd come to that view point with your limited experiance with growing in soil! I can't understand where the confusion has occurred. I'm not sure what owd's gripe is with you!

How dare you give your opinion on something, if it's not a fact don't speak, you may confuse the newbie's!

Surely anyone can give any input they want, I don't think anyone is being misleading or anything, just giving an opinion!

Thank you very much for repeatadly explaining and elaberating on the question of how RSC strains react with nutrients!

The only thing I can add to this thread:

I have three Lebanese that were started in tiny pots and then moved to pots containing 1 litre of cheap multi purpose compost - it was all I had about me and these are being grown in my conservatory to determine sex and for cuts.
There are 2 distinct phenos - one is tall and the other is very squat.

Now these have been chugging away for a good two months now in the 1 litre pots.......I have not fed them and they have not needed any feed at all. I keep arriving home from work expecting them to be pale as hell....but no, there they are lovely and green.

I'm really glad that I read this thread, once I'm sure of the sex and got a few cuts I think I'll let them finish in the greenhouse.
I was just going to bin them once I had the cuts for upstairs.

ATB

Intersex stress resposnse:

A plant responding to stimuli such as eratic light cycle or overfeeding leading to the production of seemingly male flowers and pollen



Hermaphrodite:

A chomosomally confused plant, usually bred from chemicall induced intersex stressed plants, their genetics are hermaphroditic, it is not environmentally induced.


Some would probably suggest that the two sort of intermingle particularly with regards to the ease of stressing an intersex response into feminised seeds.





can I have my points now?



P.S. growing a mix of RSC and they look great apart from the first attempt where I germed them in soil that was too hot. started with a mix of 50-50 perlite-compost and killed a few shiberghans...sorry... but now with a 70-30 mix they are looking sweet.

you are very welcome

Thank you very much. I am glad somebody understood it Dont know what the deal with Owd´s was aswell, but i dont care about that much now..new day...new beginning right ?

A true hermaphrodite is something that you can select against

Even if the gene is recessive?

A lot of land in Nepal and Afghanistan, while capable of growing crops probably isnt as 'rich' as store bought compost and the addition of strong doses of liquid feed might be overdoing it.

I think that is what Namkha is saying.

Have you ever seen pics of fields of cannabis growing in places like lebanon/afghanistan etc in parched dusty soil (but which still produces the best HASH in the world) and thought to yourself, Wow I wonder what it would be like if they had proper nutes?!
My friend from afghanistan told me that they used bird shit on the cannabis (whether chicken/other bird I dunno).
But I Bet that MOST of the fertiliser/compost from cows and animals goes towards fertilising their FOOD crop and not the drug crop.


I have two RSC Mazar atm and they were very vigorous in veg.
They didnt require a lot of liquid feed.
Allthough totally rootbound they didnt show N deficiency for a long time.
I have topped em and pruned the roots (to manage height) and I will flower em off now.
They have both been treated with essence as they got fungal spots (the more sativa pheno being the most succeptible to fungus).

I'm not sure FAS....Hence the

I think that is where Mum and Dad selection is so important, stressing their environment etc...to pick up on any recessive traits