if you dont know what it is read this :


Abdominal pains, nausea and compulsive bathing are indicators of a newly diagnosed disorder related to chronic cannabis use, according to a South Australian GP.

Dr Hugh Allen, who works in the Adelaide Hills, defined cannabinoid hyperemesis or 'marijuana morning sickness' after studying about 15 long-term, chronic marijuana smokers, all of whom had a peculiar behavioural pattern.

'They all smoked marijuana and had for several years had a prolonged history of cyclically vomiting and funny bathing behaviour,' he said.

'They would have a hot bath, jump out, start feeling sick again, so jump back in. Some had 5 to 6 baths a day, some had 15.'

Dr Allen said the disorder was 'like an allergy to cannabis', with the only cure being complete cannabis cessation.

Pointers to cannabinoid hyperemesis

Dr Allen says pointers to cannabinoid hyperemesis include:

* a history of ongoing cannabis abuse;
* cyclical episodes of vomiting; and
* compulsive bathing behaviour.

He says the disorder is curable if patients stop using cannabis, but will return if patients take up the habit again.



well my friend has been in and out of hospitals for years and has recently stumbled upon this info ..he has decided to quit for two to three months to see if his symptoms stop ..but the question i have is this ,his friend also had these symptoms and stopped smoking as he was going to india ..whilst in india he was smoking charas with none of these symptoms reappearing ,so is it possible that landrace indicas will not affect the cannabinoid receptor in the gut like the more bred varieties of europe and the u.s ? i know that a lot of landrace varieties have much higher amounts of cbd and not massively high thc levels ..they seem to be more in balance of cannabinoids too from what ive read on namkhas site .

does anyone have any experience of this illness and is it possible that there is a strain out there that will aggravate the symptoms ,at present my friend is having up to 10 boiling hot baths a day so i guess his illness is at quite an advanced or aggravated state .

thanks for any info in advance ...vince

Never heard of that.
So what does the bath do? Stop him feeling sick?

In my not vastly informed opinion it's pure fucking bullshit.

I've heard of this 'syndrome' before and to me Its a load of absolute cunt. Your mate needs to sort his shit out.


NOTE: I may be completely wrong, and if I am apologies to your mate.

Your mate probably shouldn't smoke much pot. Anybody that exhibits odd behavioural symptoms should probably stop, and that is not normal.

I'm not sure about this problem - I've NEVER come across anything like this, and I have known a lot of potheads. The name means 'Cannabis Vomiting'. it just sounds like anxiety - cocaine makes me feel edgy, upsets my stomach before I take it, and I feel I keep having to wash my hands.

Sounds like another 'Chronic hashism' to me..

well i can assure you that after over 150 hospital admittances due to severe stomach pain /passing out not being able to eat anything for up to 5 days as it just comes back up ,having just about every possible test done from mri scans to colonoscopies it is certainly very very real for him ..this has been going on for over ten years for him and the hospital consultants cant find anything untoward ,no kidney stones ,gall stones ,cancer ,inflammation ,parasites etc ...hes seriously not well at all and the symptoms hes suffering from match the description of hypermesis spot on .its gotten to the point where all he can think of is ending it all as he has to give up something he loves dearly but cannot deal with the pain anymore ,the hospital now just dose him up on morphine and send him home (he currently is in communication with his local mp over being treated like shit by st marys hospital staff on many occasions )

the hot baths seem to calm the tension in the stomach ..so it looks like when he smokes or vapes the stomach clenches and stays clenched due to the cannabinoid lowering the stomachs tempreture which in turn is slowing his ability to digest food causing backlogs (no pun intended although i did snigger)..but other than that i dont know thats why im asking about it here ,in case someone else has come across it before and has advice for the poor bugger other than quit which he did yesterday .

Does a heat pad on the stomach bring any relief?

yes only temporary he says ...ten minutes max whereas a hot bath gives an hour or there abouts

yeah i used to get severe stomach pains and i found what helped it was hanging a towel on a roastin hot radiator and then when it was real hot put it on my belly

i used to get it every day as soon as i would light up a spliff, i finally managed to work out it was coffee in the end
as everytime i rolled one i made a coffee aswell

im sure it was either to do with the coffee itself or maybe the milk, either way strictly been on black tea for about a year now with no more pain

but i see what ya mean bout the hot baths to sooth the pain

I'm no doctor, but to me the cannabinoid hyperemesis sounds a little more psychological - like a compulsion to bathe, with anxiety pains and sickness?

He's going to have to stop weed for a while, it's the only way to find out what is causing it. I assume he has been checked for other intolerances - wheat/lactose/caffeine/alcohol etc.?

hes been checked for just about everything as far as i know ..ill mention the coffee thing to him as well ..just in case ..then he can remove one thing at a time to elimate them from the equation

So, basically you're saying that smoking cannabis makes him vomit...If that is the case, which I doubt, wouldn't he have realised much sooner, before making all those hospital visits?

I've gone deaf in one eye and blind in one toe, i also suffer fungal nail infection in my left ear.

Sounds like a dietary disorder exacerbated by cannabis use, especially that fact you mention him going to India and not having the problems yet was still smoking charas.

It's certainly an interesting thread though, best of luck to your friend

I don't wanna sound like Dr House doing a diagnosis, but that is suspicious that his friend had the same symptoms, do they eat at the same takeaways, or buy from the same dealer?

Wow Vince your matey must be having a hell of a time!

Never heard of anything like that b4.

double edged sword...... i hope its true so your matey gets his life back, i hope its not as it would be much more ammo for the haters.

Volc.

speaking with him now and even he thinks it might be bullshit ..but hes giving it a try ,no weed for 3 months ..

I'd be suprised to hear that he has spent a decade with stomach cramps and hasn't been on an exclusion diet.

Coffee and milk fuck me right up, only found out a few years ago.

A seclusion diet is hard work, really hard day to day, but if he's in that much pain; it's an easy way to a possible solution.

I can understand your friends need to assign a label to his suffering. Chronic illness sucks balls. Not knowing what it is or why it is sucks dirty sweaty balls.

Are you sure he's not been chasing the dragon?

haha no dragon chasing ..solely weed for the last 18years ..doesnt drink coffee or alcohol ..hes tried the diet thing a few years back to see if it was dairy or whatever it was ..

i just feel sorry for him ..and ive never heard of this hyperwhatsit ..so please dont have a go at me ,calling it bullshit ,i dont know if its real ,i know his symptoms are and all im doing is relating them here ,fuck for all i know theyre maybe loads of people who have this on here and didnt realise or couldnt equate it to anything in particular ..

Maybe he is just allergic to pot?

well that was my first thought ..ive seen people get rashes from sativas ...maybe hes getting the same thing in his stomach ..


who the fuck knows what it is ..ill check back here later in case anyone has anything helpful to add ..if not then at least i asked around

Beats me Vince - no idea mate

matey has just emailed me this

Cannabinoid hyperemesis syndrome: Clinical diagnosis of an underrecognised manifestation of chronic cannabis abuse.
- cite this + cite this
Collect
- Hide Abstract + View Abstract
Cannabis is a common drug of abuse that is associated with various long-term and short-term adverse effects. The nature of its association with vomiting after chronic abuse is obscure and is underrecognised by clinicians. In some patients this vomiting can take on a pattern similar to cyclic vomiting syndrome with a peculiar compulsive hot bathing pattern, which relieves intense feelings of nausea and accompanying symptoms. In this case report, we describe a twenty-two year-old-male with a history of chronic cannabis abuse presenting with recurrent vomiting, intense nausea and abdominal pain. In addition, the patient reported that the hot baths improved his symptoms during these episodes. Abstinence from cannabis led to resolution of the vomiting symptoms and abdominal pain. We conclude that in the setting of chronic cannabis abuse, patients presenting with chronic severe nausea and vomiting that can sometimes be accompanied by abdominal pain and compulsive hot bathing behaviour, in the absence of other obvious causes, a diagnosis of cannabinoid hyperemesis syndrome should be considered.
Sontineni SP, Chaudhary S, Sontineni V, and Lanspa SJ
World journal of gastroenterology : WJG 15(10):1264-6, 2009 Mar 14 - Who cited this? | PubMed ID: 19291829 | Fulltext


from lab news

sauce :h**p://www.labmeeting.com/papers/public_search?query=cannabis+hyperemesis

Cannabinoid hyperemesis syndrome= a diagnosis to be given when a dr doesn't know whats going on and the patient smokes cannabis..

well i thought that too initially ..now i just dont know ..after seeing this on a medi site ..which stupidly i didnt bookmark

(1) A history of several years of cannabis abuse prior to the onset of hyperemesis in susceptible individuals.

(2) The hyperemesis will follow a cyclical pattern every few weeks or months, often for many years, against a background of regular cannabis abuse.

(3) Cessation of cannabis leads to cessation of the hyperemesis in the presence of a negative urine drug screen for cannabinoids.

(4) A return to cannabis use will see a return of the hyperemesis many weeks or months later.

(5) The patient will compulsively bathe i.e. will take multiple hot showers or baths during the acute phase of the illness in an attempt to quell the hyperemesis.



The patho-physiology is as follows:



(a) Susceptible patients develop a hypersensitivity to cannabis following several years of exposure.

( Cannabis has a long half-life of weeks or months in the body. Regular use is accumulative and this gives rise to toxicity in the hypersensitive patient.

© It has been shown that cannabis delays gastric emptying[4] and in the toxic patient this may lead to gastric stasis and hence hyperemesis.

(d ) The patient may compulsively bathe because of the presence of the cannabinoid receptors in the limbic system of the brain[3]. The toxicity may disrupt the thermoregulatory systems of the hypothalmus and this disruption might settle with hot bathing or showering.


bizarre to say the least ..

Sounds like ocd/anxiety to me.

Does this explain why I have big stomach aches before exceptionally large 'downloads' the morning after a chronic cannabis binge ? Like a huge blockage! - I always considered it a dope hangover - very rarely happens at home but seems that every time I wake up in the dam I feel like shit until I have had a shit.

Has he tried vaping it instead? seems alot of people have had problems clear up with a good vape instead of smoking.

Nausea/sickness may be a symptom of anxiety, I have never heard of people being regularly sick with using Cannabis (apart from the odd whitey)
perhaps he is allergic to weed, you say he used hash without problems so it may be just herbal that affects him or perhaps some contamination or unflushed weed containing
some chemical that disagrees with him?.

i love having baths ..
..and reading about faeries.


but im sure im not ill......



ps. bish is cool .



peace

hey,

I've been reading this thread with interest.

I smoke probably about 1g a day of local nz bud, pretty good indoor stuff round here, probably close to whats been grown on these boards, although no curing seems to go on round here , if its dry its sold!I used to grow but got busted by the5-0 a while back and been keeping a low profile for a while, keen to get back into it soon tho.

I used to suffer from really bad cramps, and have frequent bowl movements (I mean like every 5 mins, no crap haha no pun intended) I had every test, u name it endoscopy, colonoscopy, barium meal, and they couldn't find anything.It got so bad I was sometimes up the hospital on iv morphine to control the spasams.I ended up having a laperoscopy where they cut some holes on my stomoch, filled it with gas and put a camera in, and guess what...STILL NOTHING after this my specialist was stumped.

I've always wondered if maybe my smoking was causing the problem, because sometimes (although def not all the time) I would have a bit of a flare up whilst I was having a sesh.
All of a sudden one day it cleared up, now i still go to the toilet more often than most, but I don't have the intense pain I once had, and I mean it was bad, I had to give up work because of it.
I never stopped my regular smoking (why should I if I wasn't certain ) so didn't find out if it was the cause, my specialist said it shouldn't matter.

Any comments from people that have heard of this before would be appriciated.

Cheers

it wasnt him that said about the charas ,it was his mate who had been out in india ..and to answer the questions ..he flushes his weed very well and its always cured ,he uses only natural organic feeds ..he does have some stress in his life but thats been caused by this illness and having to deal with doctors who have tried everything possible to find out whats wrong ,hes even been having sessions with a chinese qi gong specialist who said that she could sort him out within 3 months ,but nothing ..it does sound like an ocd ..in fact i showed him lots of research into very small doses of anti depressants to cut the tie between the minds memory and the stomachs memory ..yes he uses a vaopriser as well (volcano classic and the iolite) but with the same effect ,mornings are worse than any other time .phew i think thats all the answers i have .

but the more i read about this hyperemesis the more it sounds like his problem ,weird one this ..he reports that he`s feeling 50x better for not having anything cannabis related over the last 24 hours ..maybe it is what he`s got ..strange for sure ,ill report back over the next few days to see if his symptoms return without using weed

However this could also mean he was not stressed on his holiday & when he returns to his more stressful life after holiday the cramps come back? Is he suffering any stress? Doctors seem incapable of diagnosing anything that does not have a visible symptom.

I know that not everyone can smoke cannabis, some get stomach cramps & just fall asleep etc. These people should leave it alone & normally do. IME it is unusual for someone to like something that makes them feel ill though?






Indeed guys Some people cannot stomach milk, lactose intolerance. Does he drink full fat milk? I know you said he does not drink coffee, but it is normall

I think the fact that the reports are from March 09, the year of Reefer Madness 3 makes me suspicious. But if your friend really thinks that it is cannabis then he should stop now! However I have little trust in doctors, especially GP's

Edited to remove question about weed quality as I was writing this reply before your post Vince buddy

High Temperature fluctuation alone will make a person feel nauseous, and if you add being stoned into equasion then yes, you are going to feel sick!, 5 to 15 hot baths every day is going to do this, no question!

It’s a similar feeling if you ever had a sauna. And if you want to really feel giddy try a sweat lodge! No drugs needed gets you high all on it own, seen people faint for a few seconds.

I’d say if anyones worried it’s having a bad effect on them, but still want to get stoned just don’t smoke all day. Get your tolerance down and just have small single skin J’ or couple bong hits of an evening, or try the vape route. Try and have a balanced diet, moderate exercise and get your head and body back to a more normal routine and just try and get on with life best you can and stop worrying, lifes to short.

just spoke with my buddy ..and 3 days into his abstinance hes reporting that hes eating well (which is unusal for him to eat much at all) and that hes pooed 3 times today ...usually its once every two to three days ..seems his stomach motility is speeding up to what it should be ..and for the first time since ive known him he seems happy and healthy ..so all those that mocked this ,im afraid i have to say from what ive seen and heard it seems to be a genuine ailment .even if its not at least my mate thinks it is and hes getting better ,and ultimately thats the goal .

fifteen chronic pot smokers with similar symptoms do not anything make.

had a theory but the missus just told me to get dressed to go into town.

oh yeah, disease in man is multi-factorial and blaming any one thing is usually just bad science. although potentially anything that a person swollows can produce nausea and vomiting the cns is the mediator of vomiting and not the gut. fooking meddlesome mediators.
gen

It sounds like your mate should just knock smoking weed in the head, and then maybe in the future sometime try and eat a small amount if he still craves a stone and see how he goes on from there.

M8 i wake and bake and have done for over ten years, im regular as clockwork every morning, my stone over makes me poo, sometimes i get a bit of a gut ache but it goes with the poo. i poo often, sometimes 3 or four times in a day. I think the only symptom this bloke can really have observersd that is common to heavy smokers is the feeling a bit rough in the morning ie "morning sickness" but these effects are short lived. I think that most of his group must have had some kind of OCD or other mental problem that is causing them to make themselves sick through temperature shock (hot baths).

Admittedly i do have hot baths, but i dont feel sick jump out and back in again, i just like the bath hot and sometimes when i get out i feel a little light headed but not to the point of vomiting. Having many many baths a day indicates some other mental issue ie not being able to make yoursself clean, or enjoying vomiting and making it happen or something else weird, i think to say that it will affect all heavy regular smokers like this is utter bullshit.

The only thing that is correct imo is the fact that pot will give you bad guts, cos me and all my wake and bake m8's all wake up with "bad guts" then after a while or a dump, they go. if you stop smoking regularly you wont get stone overs. and the affects they bring, compare it to a hang over and its nothing.

To suggest that long term heavy smokers will all start manically bathing and vomiting at some point as a result of their use is again utter tripe.

The article should have suggested that if you smoke regularly and heavily be prepared for some gut ache in the morning and some weird poo's.

Hope your m8 is doing ok,

All the best

Nutes

well its day 4 of his absitnance and he believes this is the cure to over ten years of suffereing and not knowing what was wrong ,the docs also didnt have a clue what was wrong as they couldnt find anything wrong ..i agree it could all be pyschoseematical(bodderasism),im just glad to hear that he is positive again and happy ..as a heavy stoner he cant believe that giving up would free him of all the pain and mental anguish of not knowing what was wrong with himself is over (well certainly for now) ..hes so positive that the cause of his problem is the weed and is going to start a support group ..he has meetings with his docs and consultants in the next few days and will be showing them all the info that hes found about hyperemesis ..his gp is actually looking into this as he found it fascinating (that he`d never heard of this before)

Its widely known amongst medical professionals that cannabinoids can increase or decrease gut motility.(sometimes its strain dependant) i wouldnt expect a GP to know anything about it though.

Im suprised he wasnt prescribed Domperidone (Motillium) which is usually given for nausea and to stimulate gut motility. - the good news is you can just buy it over the counter, if the sickness comes back.

thats the funniest thing ive ever read. compulsive bathing haha

sorry if this is real and actually distressing people. but i think its a load of bollox. just like most ocd behaviours, they are slowly brought into your life and slowly effect you and slowly ruin things for you, and theyre all done by you, they dont just happen to you, you let them or make them happen.

if the way you behave is significantly changing and your smokin more an more weed and getting stupid ocd behaviours, stop smokin the herb! why ruin it, its a medicine, a drug, a beneficial herb, whatever it is, it changes your current thought patterns and enhances your mood, its easy to over do it and get into bad habits, just like with alcohol and any other drug.

take a break, a month, two months, a year whatever, then smoke occasionally and keep it as a hobby. dont let it become more than it is, a hobby to be enjoyed occasionally.

ahh let me explain this guys situation a bit better as the same answers are cropping up

many years ago when he started smoking ,he was homeless at the time (but thats irrespective)he used to get stomach cramps that would get so bad he would`ve tried any form of relief ..on a few occasions he would pass out from pain usually on public transport ,where upon he would be admitted to st marys ,the consultants immediately diagnosed him as having ibs ,for which he was treated ..this cycle of events would keep happening ..gradually building up to where wew are today ,he has been admitted to hospital over 100 times in ten years with the same mystery pains in the stomach ,they went through his diet to see if there was anything untoward that could aggravate what they thought was ibs ..then they tried different avenues ,saying it could be chrohns ,it could be gall stones ,kidney stones ,gastroentiritis ..basically going through any illness that could cause these symptoms ..and then giving him the medicines to treat the illness ,nothing worked ,and within a few days of leaving hospital he would be back with the pain and not being able to eat or keep food or liquids down ..he put his faith in the doctors everytime they said this will sort you out ..then over the years he lost faith in them ..and reading on the net about various ibs /chrohns .aspartame related symptoms he decided to follow advice given to him about using weed to releive his pain ..but as he used more and more the symptoms got gradually more intense ,well of course he believed that the weed was giving him relief and would take more when an attack happened ..in the last year his symptoms got really bad adn through trial and error found that if he woke up he would just jump into a hot bath as it helped calm his stomach ,,,nothing unusual about that im sure weve all found relief in a hot bath ..but he found that the baths were becoming more and more frequent ,he didnt even think that this was some kind of ocd ,just a way to ease the pain ..but up til last week he had been spending a few hours every morning trying to ease the pain ..even having a joint in the bath as well ..then his mate returned from a holiday in india (he hadnt seen the guy in 4 years so hadnt known the other guy had the same symptoms ) when this guy got in touch out of the blue and they got chatting my mate was telling him how ill he has become and described the symptoms to him ..thats when this other guy told him he had the same thing and someone else had told him of research into the build up of toxic levels of thc or cbd at the cannabinoid receptors in the stomach which lead to a slow down of the motility of the gut ..thats when i started looking around for evidence of such an illness ,and that leads us to this point ,and why i decided to start this thread to try and compare this illness to anyone who had been diagnosed or knew about it ,whether it was real or whether it was propaganda or just a plain old pyschological twitch as it were ..well its day 5 and his symptoms have all but ceased ..he now feels like he has masses of energy ,hes digesting foods that he had trouble with before ,his skin is looking better than ever ..and he`s not feeling suicidal unlike a few months back when this illness he felt was controlling his life ,which i must say has been hard to deal with ,when a doctor says youve got x and then they treat x and nothing happens so they say lets try treating you for y and then that doesnt work it can be a soul destroying process ..i hope this doesnt affect anyone especially those that have mocked or outright poo pooed the whole notion of it being real ..im certainly glad that after 30 odd years of toking its never affected me .

As much as I read, it is a singular trial on 15 people without any further investigation. Sorry but it is not even worth considering. Not to talk about the fact that the trial doesn't consider different strains, and isolate the component wich causes the problem. AKA a bit of bullshit. The trial should have been undertaken much more seriously.
Also I cannot find it on pubmed. Could You please give some more reference to check the actual work?

For your friend, i really hope that he manages to cure himself by stopping smoking because:

A) he has solved a really upsetting problem
He doesn't spend time and money cannabis and maybe he can focus on psycho therapy.

Cheers and good luck

these are some of the links he sent me

h**p://www.mydr.com.au/addictions/chronic-cannabis-use-can-cause-vomiting-and-compulsive-bathing

h**p://www.labmeeting.com/paper/28611610/chang-windish-2009-cannabinoid-hyperemesis-relieved-by-compulsive-bathing

h**p://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1774264

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h**p://gut.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstract/53/11/1566

h**p://www.practicalgastro.com/pdf/September08/BudhrajaArticle.pdf


theres tons more info out there too .

Well after suffering from pretty much EXACTLY the same symptoms as whats being described here i can tell you that this condition is very real people!! im a fairly heavy user of bongs ect and ive no doubt that its weed that causes the flare ups in my gut,and for me its showers sometimes 10-20 per day when an outbreak happens i swear its hard to take in but it helps!! ive been in and out of hospital also,loads of tests didnt show up anything at all! this is my first post in uk420 after a fiew years lurking in the darkness but i had to when i saw this!! any chance of putting me intouch with your friend as i havent ever came across anyone on this site or around me that also suffers from this dredded sickness! ive no doubt the more press the condition gets and the amount of skunk flying around these days it wont be long till its recongnised by gps over here??

had a good read over this thread and it's quite interesting and i can't help but think i had the same kind of symtoms before.... I used to get cramps in my stomach and chest (left side, was scary as shit!) when i smoked at all and got worse the more i smoked. One thing that helped was hot showers. I found out i have a condition that is dietry controlled and affects my Central Nervous System. So I decided to stop smoking and the symtoms got better and better. The thing is I was just diagnosed with this nasty condition so i was well stressed etc. But once I stopped smoking for a while and sorted my life out a bit and once i was happy again i thought i'd give the old tokage one more try... and now i smoke more now that I ever have! so maybe i had it and it went away or maybe it was just a subconscious alarm bell from my body saying "chill out mofo and sort your life out for a bit!"

not to say this is the case with everyone but the subconscious mind/body connection can be very very powerful!

hope all turns out well for your mate!

cheers mate, Ive just got over a weeks sickness myself last week, im going to give him a shout it would be good to actually hear from someone who also suffers.

And to all of the folk who came here and took the piss about the hot baths ect get a grip its a total nitemare living with this i can tell you! and no im not mad or depressed im a 27 year old guy who likes a smoke and some banter with his pals and i would love for this to go away BELIEVE ME!!!!

esse is trying to post here now gary ..hes very interested in speaking with you about this ..

yeh i had a look at [edited to remove spam] thread we both have the same condition i swear!! n it sounds like hes had a fairly rough time of it 2!

Its been around ten years for me also the sickness comes and goes but most mornings a yogurt then a shower before work quells the pains! im actually glad to have found someone else to talk to about this as it seems quite rare so far!

i cant pm your details or vice versa as you havent made enough posts gary ..can you sign up at [edited to remove spam] so he can speak to you in real time ..hes desperate to chat about this with you ..ive asked joolz if theres any way it can be done here ,but im waiting on a reply ..may take some time