my 13yr old labXcollie has just been diagnosed with cancerous tumours on her liver n spleen poor bugger, as if arthritis n senility arnt enuf she's having a spray of my sativex in her meals (twice a day) in the hope tht she'll stay mobile and pain-free 4 as long as poss.

duz any1 know if dogs have cannabinoid receptors? will it help her, or am i wasting my meds?

Iv seen plenty videos of dogs and cats stoned, so i think they must do!

sorry to hear about your dog, its heartbreaking when they get old. what about putting some real bud in her food, or baking snacks for her to give her throughout the day. im sure as long as you werent giving her too much itd be ok

They do and it will help, try increasing the dose, if she has too much then she's just going to sleep it off

Good to see you back on the here ms kitty

Yeah, dogs'll eat anything. Bake him some brownies, poor little bugger.

Hi,
Sativex has an ethanol base to it, to help the cannabis oil stay in solution when you spray it. This would leave a bitter taste in the dogs food and im sure that food is one of its favourite luxuries. Also the amounts of cannabis in a sativex spray are very low and formulated to work on the body just enough before the brain starts to get affected. If your dog eats sativex the dose required to get an effect would be even higher than the dose which they are administering through the spray. This is because the stomach breaks down a lot of the active compounds whereas adsorption through the tongues blood system allows the drug not to have to go through the digestion process in the stomach.
We used to get my cat stoned, in a cupboard. She didnt like that too much, its hard to say how animals are affected mentally by drugs because they dont speak. My only worry with giving cannabis to animals is the psychoactive effects, which to an animal may be distressing due to it not knowing why it feels the way it does.
If you did want to give your dog cannabis you are probably better off making some cannabutter and giving your dog how much you take divided by the difference in your weights.
Good luck.

I would suggest doggie chocs and sativex, like canna choc, 125 grammes of doggie choc to one bottle of sativex.

then it would metabolite through the liver, giving higher delta cannabinoids.

as Sativex is a whole plant extract cbds as a bonus for your doggie

good luck

where is this information from ??



your an animal abuser and show concern pffffffffftt

[quote name='maryjane' date='Jun 5 2009, 06:52 PM' post='1785651']
[quote name='jason24msc' post='1785605' date='Jun 5 2009, 06:26 PM']Hi,
This is because the stomach breaks down a lot of the active compounds whereas adsorption through the tongues blood system allows the drug not to have to go through the digestion process in the stomach.

where is this information from ??

The sativex ingredients are on the packet (http://www.bayer.ca/files/SATIVEX-PM-ENG-18DEC2008-119950.pdf)(page 4).
The Mechanism of adsorption of drugs in to the body can be found in any undergraduate pharmacology textbook. The degradation of almost all drugs in the stomach is an effect called the 1st pass effect which reduces the efficacy of most drugs. I learnt this in the pharmacology parts of my undergraduate course at university.
The stomach will not give you more delta cannabinoids as the delta cannabinoids are present in natural cannabis already. The liver acts to break down these compunds and in the case of THC and CBD they are broken down to their less active forms available to be excreted. I will find you links for the pharmacalogical action of THC if you dont believe me. Check out Raphael mechoulams stuff or ethan russo.
Oh and we were only 15 when we terrorised the cat, so things change.

Cannabis with fat then metabolised through the liver, absorption is increased not decreased, and as Sativex is sub lingual, its absorbed into the bloodstream.

Pleased to hear you have stopped the abuse of animals

Hi ms kitty........

as Danzig said "Nice to see you back"....


Do you think that maybe her time has come and an hard decision has to be made?

I know how you feel about your dog,I'm exactly the same and I could give you a long impassioned post what your dog means to you but I know if I had the complaints that your dog has.......I think I'd be grateful if someone could stop it before I went through too much.

Please don't take offence if I've posted something that offends you,thats not my intent,but just an observation that I'd be having.

I think you need your meds more than the dog. .

Anyway take care and hope to see you post more.

shes at a good old age now most big dogs dont last to 13 very sorry to hear about her. if she was human she would be classed as 91 now but to last this long i can tell you have looked after her and wouldent be asking questions on here if you dident care about her.if things get worst and i know its hard have a chat with your vet dont feel guilty about anything shes had a good life to live this long.ferret

sorry to hear about your companion, i feel more upset when dogs are hurt than humans. thc does work on them as i found out the hard way, me old pooch wouldn't get off me bed for nothing. ended up sleeping on the couch that night
hope it makes their days more enjoyable.

Im guessing that you are saying that the absorption of cannbinoids is increased when orally administered compared to sub lingual. Then why is sativex sub-lingually administered if its not the most efficient route. Are GW wrong?
Cannabis is most easily absorbed through the gut when mixed with oils or fats because the fatty surrounding helps the THC move through the fatty lining of the stomach. The polar nature of THC is what restricts THC alone moving through tissues (which is mainly composed of nonpolar proteins and fats). THC is more attracted to the charged water etc. in stomach than fatty tissues so it does not pass the lining of the stomach very easily. But the polar nature of THC also allows it to enter into the bloodstream across thin blood vessels because blood has polar/charged components to it, so there is a strong attraction across an easily penetrateable membrane, hence the reason why you get better absorption via sub lingual administration.
If that is a bit complicated for anyone im happy to answer questions in a new thread rather than spoiling this one with pharmacalogical jargon.
peace out.

Higya Ms Kitty
Good to see you post again, I hope you are in good form?

Please do not be upset, but I have to agree with O.G.


Can you put your dog in a sort of trance by gently massaging the back of her ear, just where it adjoins the neck/head? Some dogs will lean into your hand and start grunting with pleasure when this is done, keep on doing it and they can sometimes go into a sort of trance like haze, which can help them when they are in pain. Its a long shot, doesn't always work. But worth a shot. Human touch is so very important to her now.

hi evry1, thanks 4 all of th replies much appreciated

2 many 2 bugger about quoting n replying individually, soz, so hopefully this'll answer evry1 ...

i took her 2 vet 4 pain relief advice 4 her arthritis, n bout her senility - gon bak 2 puppyhood, weeing, chewing, not coming wen called etc. vet checked her liver 2 make sure she'd b ok 4 pain meds, n found abnormalities.

tested her 4 cushings disease n gave her glucosamine+chondroitin chews. test was negativ so did ultrasound n found th tumours

meanwhile tho, she's perked up back-legs-wise n is romping happily on walks again, biting th postman n chasing ducks. she still timbers over by bedtime, but she's had fun n activity in th day beforehand.
day 3 of sativex n she was full of beans this morning trotting about waggin her tail n chewin my carers false thumbnail with glee

th vet sed its time 2 bring her in when she's vomiting n squitting, ii'm keeping her diet v bland 2 not tax her liver 2 much. so the arthritis chews n pedigree jointcare stiks r th only treats i'll giv her. she's a gannet - eats owt, n th sativex hasn't put her off her meals

i'll stik with sativex, coz its high in cbd. th only weed iv got is a head-high n duz bugger all 4 my body, so i wudnt giv it 2 my dog.

so... with her general demeanor improving n her luv of life n fun still strong, i'm not killing her off just yet i put my eldest cat down last yer, n his buddy 2 yrs b4 tht. altho it breaks my heart, i'm not afraid 2 let go, n won't let my animals suffer unneccessarily.

i'm gonna giv her a bedtime dose as well as tht ear massage vet-time might b 2mrw, next week or next month - wotever happens, she'll go with a smile on her face


cheers all
x

ed- 4got 2 say th vet was surprised at her heart - as strong as a young dog!

Nice one ms kitty

Sativex it is then, and happy dog.

hi kitty

so sorry to hear of J's decline in health. (as if you dont have enough to put up with already)

back in 2006, our late staffy (bart) went to the vets for a check up as he seemed a bit poorly. we were given the choice to have him put down there and then as the vet diagnosed cancer of the bones similar to human leukemia. we were distraught and decided to take him back home for our last farewells before a return trip to the vets to have him put down.
anyway, to cut a long story short, i decided to give him some of my weed with warm milk. sometimes once a day, sometimes once every other day.
he lasted a very happy and contented further 6 months.
during this 6 months, he had a regular fortnightly check up at the vets. they were amazed as to how he kept going and to this day i believe it had a lot to do with his magic milk
i hope J gets the same relief from sativex as bart seemed to get from his magic milk.

Hi ms kitty, as others have said good to see you posting again

Very sad post though, really sorry to hear of your dogs condition. I hope he gets many more pain free months in a sativex fueled haze

As bart said it seemed to prolong the happy times for his dog, so I hope it has the same affect for your dog.

A few years ago I popped outside to catch the milkman and my Lab munched his way through an eighth of my weed. At first I was upset but actually, he seemed to enjoy it. He jumped up on my lap (which he never did) and vegged out, his arthritis didn't bother him as much for the rest of the day and he smiled at me more than usual (Yes... he used to smile to greet me, his name was smiler because of it. I might have a picture of that somewhere). It was amusing. It wasn't long after that that I had to take him to the vet for the last time, as a buddhist; euthanasia is a complicated subject but a wild animal wouldn't see old age like that and so a balance is sought between what is kind and what is a selfish need to remember our dogs as they were when young. My opinion: It's gotta be worth a try, they are loyal for life so we have a duty to them too. Good luck.

Aww this is really upsetting to hear about your dog im sure shes thanking you for giving her decent pain/stress relief.
Ive got an old dog, this post made me realise she wont be lasting long either

All the best

hi evry1, its good to b back!

im hoping tht sativex contains th good bits in weed tht can slow illnesses. im still around after all, y not hope 4 my dog

i dont think you can get a smilier dog than a lab



it is sad 2 think bout it, but duznt half make u appreciate (+ spoil) em more

Oh yeah deffo does, just givin my 2 dogs (little n large) some of our fish n chips each for a special treat...your fault kitty made me go all soppy

When they were looking at me with them sad eyes, saying please give me a chip dad

ms kitty,

you don't know me as i am new to the board. i am disabled and a medical toker. i also lost my closest companion, a mixed terrier, to kidney failure. she helped me in so any ways to cope. if at the time i had the option of treating her with sativex, or anything else, i would not have hesitated.

just to let you know i am thinking of you and yours

little wing

just done some reading and found that thc in dogs can last a few days ....so id be sparse with the old spray....my dog ate 14g of my last grow ,she was walking backwards,laying down with her legs in the air ,i was laughing one minute and getting worried the next ....her name is shiva ,gona try post a pic for you lot here

greeting pienmash............. i think with a name like shiva she was in a true altered state! love the name............

o yeah she lloves eating my outdoor crop ,i dont tell her off either coz she the mummy of ganja

Hi , Just a suggestion , having lost a my dog earlier this year I was lucky enough to come across EFT (emotional freedom technique) and I must say it was a great help , good for other stuff too , theres lots of info and vids out there about it ,hope you dont need it , or for a long time , though it is usefull to know anyway . Apparently pets can be tapped too!

hi guys
(belated) welcome 2 u, little wing

update:

she's not showin symptoms of pain or liver damage yet
however, th sativex seems 2 hav made her 4get her arthritis
instead of plodding down th wheechair ramp at th bak door, she thought she cud still jump off it halfway down. her bak end gave way n she sat ther feeling silly, but at least it was only her pride tht was hurt.

didnt stop her jumping bak on l8r tho, so we've had 2 put a garden chair ther 2 make sure she duznt do it again


edit - bloody hell, just went out 4 a toke, n she cleared th top of th ramp in a runnin jump i spose im being overprotective, but another chair is going ther! a bust leg wud b th end of her at her age

I am sure that on the Cannabis episode of Horizon? on BBC2 earlier this year it was said that everything that evolved from some kind of sea slug millions of years ago has canna receptors, so all mammals would.

I may have made that up I was very baked when i watched it - i will d/l it and check some time this week.

11Hydroxy-THC is produced in the liver and is more active not less

Sorry to hear about your dog. In my experience dogs love being stoned though, so it probably will help. My dog used to chill around near me while I was smoking and get high from passively inhaling the smoke, I noticed he used to go through three stages when he was stoned. The first stage would be him being totally hyper and bouncing around with his toys etc, the second stage would be him going on a complete munchie and eating about 2 bowls of dog food, then he would fall asleep. He seemed to enjoy being high almost as much as I do.

It seems you are right although I haven't checked the references. Although to be fair, it is hydroxy delta cannabinoids that are made in the liver. Thanks Danzig for clarifying and sorry I will try not to make assumptions seem like facts in the future. Ooops.

"This intermediate-onset delivery system, which also permits patients to take small increments of medicine, is believed to be an improvement over other forms of administration, particularly oral administration. Gastrointestinal absorption of oral Delta-9-THC exposes the compound to a first pass effect and hepatic metabolism of Delta-9-THC to 11-hydroxy-THC, thought to be more psychoactive than Delta-9-THC with an onset of effect that is long and unpredictable. Patients, therefore, cannot reliably titrate their dose after oral administration to avoid side effects, including psychoactivity. As the Institute of Medicine has stated" (19) from http://www.globaldrugpolicy.org/1/1/2.php

I'm pretty sure that this article is the reason why GW have become so secretive with their research now, because the American government published all the results GW have obtained in the last seven years without consent.

Oh and miss kitty, I just realised, cannabis has anti tumour properties and it will almost certainly get to the liver when ingested. So it may help the liver tumour and arthritis. I would carry on doing it, but try and mask the alcohol taste with sugar.
Good luck