When i was 15 i used to hang out with people much older than me,in their 20,s and 30,s.These lovely people thought it good to introduce a 15 year old child to heroin.Once they had "given" me a hit ( one of them injected me) i owed them,they bullied me into getting money every day to buy heroin to share with them,i quickly became addicted. I used high doses of heroin every day for over 7 years,the last 3 of these on methadone also.As i said i was on methadone but found it hard to let go of the heroin,methadone just isn,t the same,I,m now 27 and for the past 4 or 5 years ive been "stable" on the methadone without using heroin but i want a normal life without having to worry about having enough whenever i go on holiday or anything.Ive tried to kick the meth on several occasions with varying degrees of success,when i say success i mean ive never kicked it,the best ive done is reduce,although im still on a quite large dose.The thing is even on my full dose i still feel unwell,ive no appetite,no energy but the worst thing is the leg aches,horrible pain thats like pain,tickling and an itch you cant scratch all rolled into one hellish feeling in my legs and lower back.As a child i suffered with restless legs so i think this antagonises the situation So with me feeling sick at the best of times trying to reduce and ultimately kick the methadone seems impossible.Do any of you knowledgeable people know of any strains that would help with severe opiate withdrawal,mainly the aching legs and back but the other symptoms also,any info will be greatly appreciated. I dont want to patronise people with real medical conditions as i know mine is at least some self inflicted but im suffering all the same,thanks again for any help

I feel for you mate, dont give in,. A good life is ahead of you!

Best of luck, bad to be giving a 15 year old this stuff....

Are the people who initially gave you it still on it themselves?

what about the strain 'opium'?
could be just as effective as any other strain, but its name was certainly given for a reason.

otherwise look for a potent long-lasting indica. white rhino might be a good choice

I'm in a similar situation, and now on opiates for my Crohns disease.
I was introduced to heroin at 13. Not injected though, more of a "Oi, come here..breathe from this bottle top.."

Yeah..

read up on iboga, i hear this has helped loads of people with bad habbits to me in my opion you might aswell be on heroin if your on meth, meth is just safer cleaner, no real diference and you given it,

but iboga is suposed to be real helpful with kicking bad habbits good luck.

I'm sorry, but Methadone is way dirtier, more addictive and far more destructive to your body than Heroin.
Heroin (Diamorphine), when not polluted and cut, is in fact an extremely clean and safe drug comparatively speaking. It leaves the body's organs by and large alone, unlike so many synthetics. Its one great downside is its addictiveness.
Which has, IMO, been hugely over-stated.

hi skunkrat

1st of all well done for getting off that fucking shite myfriend. i spent nearly 15 years at the mercy of heroin...everything else came second place to that evil stuff. i lost all my morals , all my friends and the respect of my family. i was not there for my son and step daughter whilst they were growing up. i just try and say to myself its now and the future that matters.

i ended up in rehab, but just to come off the gear and get stable on methodone. i was on 130ml daily for what seemed like ages, but after a while i was so fucked off with feeling sick when i had it and thru most of the day.

i dont think i would have coped if it was not for my weed, that helped me chill at night and have a little appetite, it is very important to eat and keep your strength up. i had grown a few different strains around the time but found shiva to really help me the most (cant remember what seedbank)

i always tried to keep the best routine i could when taking my meddi, the best for me was to wake up and have it about 4.00am, that way i could go back to sleep and wake up ok. also i was asleep at night when the shittiness started to kick in. i think you will always get the odd shiver during the day, if that happens, get up and do something it will soon ride out.

but the most important thing with meddi, espeicially when dropping is DO NOT USE MEASURING CAPS, there shite. get urself a huge syringe barrell (i know..but its important) , it's the only way of getting a precise measurement. dont trust (if the chemist gives you seperate bottles) that its bang on, i noticed when i eventually got down to under 20ml that it would always be + or - 2ml how ya meant to stablise like that????

best of luck to ya mate

not sure if i agree arnold mate

i've counted 14 friends (well associates) that have died to heroin, due to o'd ing and the crap thats in it. and 0 people i know to die from methodone. i aint saying methodone is not bad for you, but its pretty much a certainty that i'd be dead now if it wernt for that

e2a, hmmm have just read that properly, but still imo it got to better for you 'as a user'

like arnold said unadulturated heroin will be safer and cleaner obiously but who now days get UNADULTERATED DRUGS IN THE UK?

and how people would put unkown shite into there body is beyond me, my biological father is a junckie this pissed me off,
most junckies i know are wastes of space and it's neveer there fault that they strarted the dirty skag in the first place,
like i said read up on iboga root,

Sorry to hear about your friends, are you saying that street Heroin killed them or their Diamorphene habit?

IMO It is perfectly plausible to live a happy, productive "normal" life if it is clean Heroin.

Good luck to the OP

oh yeh and what's the point in coming of heroin to be stuck on meth for god knows how long?

Hi skunkrat sorry to hear your in a bad way mate. This might sound stupid and im not really suggesting it as a means to an end but up hear in scotland alot of my friends got into heroin about 12 years ago and all of them (about 26) got off it the same way. Alcohol believe it or not. The problem with meth as Arnold said is that it is harder to get off than the bloody heroin itself and there was no doctors in this area that would deal with it properly. Alcohol on the other hand has numerous places to go and as they were all relitivly young ( the addicts) the doctors were eager to help.

Now i know its not good to replace one bad habit with another but what is the meth program if not that.

But to answer the original question, i find hawian snow from arssjan at ghs is fantastic at detatching yourself from your body and also give you a good break from your stresess. I broke my leg in 14 places 2 years ago and it is full of metal pins and plates so i have a constant feeling of unrest and of alien objects in my leg, HS is the only weed i have found that helps with it.

Cheers Tico.

because it stops people injecting which causes shit loads more problems down the line i.e vein damage nerve end damage and much more.

i tried to stop the gear more than twenty times in the 15years but i done it on 2nd attempt with the help from methodone. and nearly 12 month on that aint much compared is it..imo

your right mate, 'if it were free' AND not injecting. but when addicted you spend all day EVERYDAY trying to find the money for it. how is that normal?

what are the health risks of using methodone?
so ur to graduly taper this crap down to virtualy low dose then stop?
how do the doctors know your not smoking smak and using meth aswell?

Undoubtedly pharmaceutical grade diamorphine is what should be prescribed to addicts rather than the pharmacologically dirty methadone. However I appreciate that in lieu of diamorphine, methadone is better than street heroin in providing a more stable substitute addiction that can potentially be weaned off. The harms associated with street heroin are as a direct result of prohibition not the drug per se. It is of unkown purity and therefore strength and so potentially very easy to od if you get something purer than usual. Secondly all the infections and embolic events that arise from IV drug use without appropriate aseptic drugs, works and technique. These harms and others associated directly with methadone use - diversion of methadone to opioid naive children has killed a couple of children where I live. Also from the point of view of the user I would be concerned about the risk of sudden cardiac death particularly on high doses of methadone.

As far as which strain to help you I couldn't honestly say as I have managed to avoid opioid addiction so far as yet and therefore have no personal experience to offer but if weed helps you then homegrown weed will help you more, irrespective of the strain. Personally these days I'm liking the more up high sativa strains like ACE seeds Nepalese Jam that I am currently smoking.

Good luck whatever you choose.



edited for sense

piss/saliva tests weekly. but ur only cheating urself if u are using on top

why do people still use heroin in the first place i mean with all the stories you hear all the time about it, when do u ever hear of somebody having a good life using this drug?
u must think nah thatrs not gona happen to me how niaeve can somebody be? wtf i just cant understand this

The vital words being "the crap that's in it". Pure Diamorph is very clean, very safe when used properly. The reason you have zero freinds from Meth is down to its pharmaceutical purity, is my guess.
The science is clear: Diamorph is much safer than methadone. But you can't get clean diamorph, that's the problem, that's the killer. Prohibition = bad gangsta drugs = death. Normalisation is required.
Methadone is a dirty hard drug, Its one I'm glad I never got onto.

Responsibility? I addicted myself. Several times, several types of drugs. Then I detoxed myself. Its all down to you as an individual. You cant blame others or anything else bar yourself; you can't lean on anyone or anything for help, except yourself.
Know this, and you can be free, if you truly want to be. To want freedom, is the first and greatest step to getting it.

You should count yourself lucky then mate

some people's live aren't so comfortable though, it's not always the simple choice it looks like from the outside.

Do you believe every story you hear?
It is perfectly possible to lead a normal and productive life as a heroin addict, provided supply is regular, clean and affordable. I once helped an addict think through his addiction. He was and still is a successful high-flyer in the business world, founded and controls a huge multi-national empire, rides around in a Roller etc etc. Been a Heroin addict for over thirty years.

E2A:
Good luck to the OP. Maybe facing the demon without the prop of Cannabis or other drugs is what is needed? If you can, don't allow folks to moralise your problem - you know, making it a right v wrong issue. It isn't, and the last thing you need is the guilt trip others foist on you. There's no blame, there's no wrong; there is a hard habit that has you, and needs breaking, is all. And you can beat it, you know. But it'll be a damned fekkin hard fight with many a tear and maybe some blood shed (psychologically speaking). But it is worth it. Just do it. And good luck

yeh i am blessed compared to some lives, why isnt it so simple then sadsack?

many ov theese high-flying junkie's do u know?

i know not all heroin users are bad people am just pissed of cuz i have come accros a few nobs in my life, one being my father, i gues i just take ofense when i hear some body defending peole using heroin,
i dont mean to sound agressive or whatever,

Well for starters perhaps the person had the most horrendous childhood, tortured by the images and feeling they have going on inside them, not knowing why what happened to them happened but knowing it was wrong...and then someone offers you the chance to escape to somewhere where your mind isn't so messed up the whole time... a break from reality seems like the only way to get through life sometimes.

To paraphrase walk a mile in their shoes before you make such sweeping 'what are you all thick ya junkies?' type of statements.

Aw it's sad this topic... My Brother in law was on the gear for ten years, he told me the only way to stop was cold turkey, he says he'll never quit, he just doesn't do it any more. He says the second you quit you want it, where as stopping doing it leaves options, options you can never take but options never the less.

My mum died on heroin when I was 11, she was addicted to it since she was 15. I was really close with my dad who told me he tried it a couple of times in jail, (he definitely never did smack when I knew him), he died of Hep C when I was 26 (no way for such a great man to go), the only culpable thing he'd ever had injected was the heroin.

Heroin fucked up my sister's and my own lives, plus made those of my nephews very hard and we never touched the stuff...

methadone killed a two of my friends and those people (the ones I know) who have ended up on it stay on it for years.

GL & TC

Edit: expanding on withnail:

My mum was abused by her dad, withnail's statements stand

x

S

since when is heroin considerd an escape? heroin- lead's to a life of more uncomfort and touble as most of us should already no,
and when did i heroin adict's thick,

Not that its any of your business, but drug counselling was something I got into for a while as a part of my job. Of the folks I helped to face their habits, I would say over half were fully employed and leading otherwise useful and legal lives. You'd be surprised who gets stuck on drugs. Nurses, Doctors, Accountants, Barristers, I've met all sorts. And I've met the other end too, the thieving, scabby sore-ridden "junkies".
But the tabloids and other media are not interested in the otherwise normal addicts, there's no "story". They want dirty, thieving, diseased junkie benefit fraudsters to wave at everyone, so that they can prop up the lie of prohibition.
Stupid thing is, it is the very prohibition they promote that creates the problem they complain of! No prohibition, no dirty thieving diseased junkies.

exactly my point listen to stealths storie sinc e when is that considered ESCAPE>???
sorry to hear that stealth,
heroin is evil shit it changes people for worse and should never be consider and escape from reality,

Skunkrat - I was on Methadone for 4 years for medical reasons - some smart doctor thought it would help my chronic nerve pain at 18 years old...

I ended up taking 40mg a day for 4 years, and found myself angry and very very tired all the time.
It did help my pain, but the side effects where bad for me and my family.

I then started smoking pot, and found that it helped ease the pain in my legs, so while reducing my dosage on methadone, I started a grow of Skunk #1, and am so far down to taking only 3mg Methadone a day instead of 40, and am slowly getting off it.

I would start a grow, and I can guarentee you that the therapy you get from growing will give you something to keep your mind active and stop you thinking about your next methadone dose. I would say that only half of the relief I get is from the weed itself, the other half is the growing side of it, where I have my girls to look after, and have no choice if I didnt want to do it one night - it has to be done - not that its a chore, its the best hobby ever.

If you want to message me feel free.

Minty

durk: Yeah mate but you and I know this from our lives, not everyone has such close contact with ppl on it day in day out.

Take your knowledge and grow with it

I sad I'm off for a bit

x

S

Folks: This is a thread about using Cannabis to help beat opiate/methadone addiction.
Let's keep it on topic, huh. Speaking to self, too
Anyone any wisdom?
Anecdotal evidence seems to suggest that using heavy stoning types can help take the edge off.

will do stealth, like i said earlier i meant no offense i still can't understand why?
my childhood up bringing was a very strange and wrong one but i never turned to heroin,
as i know this is no escape from reality,
ARNOLD- you are right about prohibiution and coverign it up with scabby juckies, i gues i never looked at it like tht,

i agree with mintball, i started growing when i was on around 100ml a day. and i cant state enough how much it took my mind off it. it really gives you something else to focus your mind on.

let growing become your new habbit skunkrat and i wish you every success for the future myfriend

Damn right Arnie.

I think pretty much all of societies problems run along similar lines. Uberduck you dont understand why people get addicted, neither do I, but it happens and therefore there are reasons for it. People self harm, I dont get that either but there are reasons for that too otherwise it wouldnt happen. Keep your mind open man. I know its been said a million times on this site but think about the press and their attitude to canna and compare it to what you know- its bullshit. Why would other stuff be any different. Lots of people have had dealings with junkies who are fucked up and doing bad shit. I would imagine the high flyers that Arnie refers to dont tend to be as visible to the man on the street as heroin addicts. Listen to as many people as you can not just your own experience and the tabloid shite.
The problems associated with heroin are cause by the shite situation of prohibition. without it the people strugling with addiction to smack and methodone would be recieving far better care, be in far better health and find it easier to come of it. Still the situation is what it is at the mo though and I wish all of you dealing with this shit all the best luck and wishes in the world.

ETA: oops, sorry, started before I saw your last post Arnie!

Sorry just one last point before it stays on topic

Arnold is correct, though I have never really touched heroin I know for a fact many people live pretty normal lives on "Clean" heroin, Its the quality of the drug, lifestyle and inability to judge the correct doses that people come a cropper with. Keef Richards is a fit as a fiddle and he used for years and years, another famous singer, song writer and guitar player is still a user but nobody would guess so as he holds everything together pretty well, I know this from first hand experience, he has used consistently since the early 80's.

Sorry back on topic now....

Hi folks,thanks for all replies and cheers for the kind words.I cant reply to people personally as there are so many i didnt think this would stir up so much discussion.So i think the consensus is i should try heavy indicas,am i correct?

Hey SkunkRat thats bad news about your social circle putting temptation in your face like that. OK ive watched a couple of documentaries about peeps not being able to quit either heroin or methadone. Do some research on ibogaine,in a couple of docu's this seems to have completely halted peeps addiction to both of these terrible drugs (and no you dont get hooked on ibogaine as a result).

RITE OF PASSAGE:
'Ibogaine - Rite of Passage' is a documentary about the use of the controversial substance 'Ibogaine' for the treatment of addiction. Ibogaine is a substance that is derived from an African plant, which is used during initiations of the Bwiti culture in Gabon. In the sixties the anti-addictive properties were discovered by Howard Lotsof, who was an American heroin addict at that time. Shortly after his discovery, Ibogaine became illegal in the US. Ibogaine is surrounded by controversy and the pharmaceutical companies show no interest in this substance. Is it because of economical reasons or its hallucinogenic effects? DOWNLOAD AT THE LINK:

http://btjunkie.org/torrent/Ibogaine-Rite-...cb0731910c4f887


DETOX OR DIE by David Graham Scott:
This powerful 45-minute program is by and about filmmaker David Graham Scott, a former heroin addict trying to kick his intense methadone dependency. An emotional, no-holds-barred look at one man's struggle to get clean, ONE LIFE: DETOX OR DIE? follows Scott as he tries a dangerous, untested new detox method that promises an intense but mercifully brief withdrawal process. DOWNLOAD AT THE LINK:

http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/3654891/On...Or_Die_Ibogaine

BBC HORIZON:
I think there is a small section on heroin and ibogaine in this movie too.
DOWNLOAD AT THE LINK:

http://isohunt.com/torrent_details/74741845/bbc?tab=summary

I hope these documentaries help you get off the filth AKA heroin,so you can start living a normal life again without the heroin handicap.
GOOD LUCK,let me know if these help.

Peace.

Although i'm not condoning the use of Heroin, It is a very good escape hense why people go back.You smoke a couple of lines,chill back your eyes close and all there is is you and your eyelids without a worry.

Your just making assumptions based on propaganda,do us a favour and shut up please.

As for Canna,the couple of times i've took it too far with Opiates i couldn't even skin up,spent most of the time in my bed wishing it would end,but i dont have any experience for the amount of H you've had.

I hope you find something that helps mate and good luck!

you can live as everyone else does as long as your stable with your addiction that isnt just heroin that goes for everything, to me it seems alot of people in this thread are going of what other people have told them not lived through there is no set standard everyone copes with drugs in different ways. for me starting smoking cannabis again and using methadone came at the same time so it helped me but not sure it does with everyone coming of heroin.

clean heroin????

now theres an oxymoron if i ever heard one

Heavy indicas. Cannabiogen Uzkeki+mazar+afghan most narcotic non opiate tried.

Hi Skunkrat,

Heavy indicas for that deep physical body stone, sure.

But have you also considered kratom? That's a drug from Indonesia and Thailand, easily available (PM me for where you get it.) Kratom is an opiate receptor agonist, with a kind of opiate-lite effect. It is an excellent analgesic, it may do wonders for that appalling 'kicky' restlessness you feel when you're quitting, it stills the mind, and many people use it with varying degrees of success to quit the stronger opiates. Kratom itself is also addictive, but the withdrawal is orders of magnitude gentler than smack/meth. It is also much easier to quit kratom by progressively lowering the dose.


Edit: Spelling

really?

clean heroin = pharmaecutically pure/very refined uncut diamorphine aka diacetylmorphine

read what Arnold says about clean heroin man, the man is talking a lot of truth here, as are a couple of other people in this thread

the major issue is, you ain't going to find it in the UK unless you can find a doc who will prescribe, or one of those "dealers to the stars"

there are countless high functioning heroin addicts in the UK and elsewhere - and if they are getting clean opiates you would never fucking know: doctors, lawyers, millionaire businessmen, academics, MPs, you name it... there was a Tory MP who injected himself in the leg in the House of Commons everyday for years

if you really want to kick, I would not recommend using cannabis, methadone, or anything else as a prop --- my tuppence would be: find the real desire to kick and then just face the motherfucker down

but that is not advice coming from experience - I'm not a user, and opiates just aren't my bag

but I'm not dumb enough to judge people with a habit - I've known a fair few over the years, and they are no better or worse than anybody else

I'd also second the advice to check out ibogaine / iboga

you could also check out vipassana meditation, in the Goenka tradition, as a new habit to replace the old and to break out of old emotional and beahvioural routines

and get away from whatever situation you have been using in: the people, the places etc. before you start the fight

all to be taken with a pinch of salt, as like I say, it's not coming from experience

all best,

Namkha

I second what Namkha and Arnie are saying here. Clean heroin is a fact, and overdoses among those who are on prescribed pharmaceutical diamorphine (heroin), administered in supervised conditions, are unknown. Pure heroin is benign, albeit addictive. It does not cause anything like the multitude of problems caused by cut street heroin; it is particularly safe.

Regarding iboga, this is a very promising treatment for opiate addiction, which has a record of some success. One of the leading Ibogaine therapists was Hattie Wells, a medical anthropologist and ethnobotanist who pioneered ibogaine treatment.

If this avenue is interesting to you, SKunkrat, you might want to read Hattie's 'Notes for Ibogaine Treatment Providers', which gives you the full rundown on what this therapy entails, risks, exclusion criteria which outline who should NOT go into ibogaine therapy, etc., etc. If you want to find out where to get iboga from, drop me a PM

The URL for Hattie's Notes is here:

hxxp://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/wells.html



Edit: added link

fukin cunt of a drug ,
get yourself down to either a bag a day or 15ml then ask for lethexadeen , wraps itself around the opiate so you can piss it out , not really that bad a come down , fuk all compared to rattling , get a good indica knock youself out for a week then thats you ... clean 9 years now , by the grace o some natural mystic , have faith & believe in yourself .
Just to add my sister a mother of four is parked on this shite (with her scummy boyfriend ).. all part of the corporate game ..make them junkies then charge them a fortune on synthetic junk .

I thought they were on benefits?

they que up in our local boots, its like its giro day... ( its quite intimidating )

i am off to see the doctor, tell him i am addicted to cannabis and i want prescribing sativex ...

yeah, and who pays peoples benefits? it's not the drugs companies





























it's US!!!!