Using Canna at the moment but a little alarmed by these comment on Greens website and also a discussion my my local grow shop at the weekend along the same lines...

"The original coco growing nutrient.

But not the best anymore. Canna Coco nutrient is a two part (A&B) one stage (combined Grow & Bloom) nutrient. In theory this makes life a lot easier but in reality it lacks enough nitrogen to promote vigorous growth in the early part of a plants life; the result is often a pale young plant, followed by a healthy mid-cycle cycle plant which then becomes a very yellow plant towards the end.

Our opinion:- It still performs pretty well and remains our biggest selling Coco feed, but better results are to be had from using a two stage grow and bloom feed such as Hesi Coco, Vitalink Coco or Ionic Coco that overall contain more nitrogen."

Seriously thinking of going "Hessi" for my next grow, would appreciate your thoughts and views...

Cheers in advance.

p.s. the price of the bloom seemed astronomical too which set me about looking at other products.

I've said for ages that canna coco feed seems to have gone down-hill.....and posted as such more than once on here
I don't think it suits everyones water for one thing and would also agree that some strains can struggle to find enough N.

I used to use canna all the time.....but after some mediocre results and a struggle to work out the problem, I decided to try a different brand of nutes.

Had good results with Ionic and even better with Hesi.....I've stuck with the Hesi for about a year now, I think it is great stuff

I switched from Canna Coco to Vitalink Coir a while back. I was finding my plants were low on N and i was having to spray with epsom salts at least once a week during early flower. I find Vitalink much better all round, i reckon it gives a much more rounded flavour too. Think its something to do with the humates in it?

I used to use vitalink before going organic and it's good stuff... If a chemical feed can be a good thing that is

wy is every one moaning on hear wy not send email to canna and then they might be able to get some sorted for you, also canna will take samples od your water and test it to see what is wrong with your water and give you the optimal nuit levels for your water


get in contact with frank

do a search for canna uk on google then email frank

all the best

hi all i just found out that greens horticulture is a hesi distributer for the uk. and he hates canna does this seem a bit strange that the same bloke thats saying canna coco is rubbish is selling the hesi nuit that he says is good.. !!!!!!!

how strange

or is it just a way of selling his hesi products

also i have test hesi and find it to leaves to much residue and if ya leave a bottle for a week is salts up round the top of the bottle

so its a fare choose i dont use coco any more i prefer hydro

but take in mind the sales tactics of the supplyers out there specialy when use uk420 for there own gains

all the best mark

dam,

I certainly don't have anything against canna - i still use their coco medium and think it is the best on the market at the moment.
What would canna put right?? Certainly not the 3 or 4 poor harvests I had.
Why should I send a water sample to them to try and put things right and lose more time and money in the process??

I think the guy at Greens says what he says because it true....IMO it is anyway.
The HEsi nutrient is far cheaper anyway......£18 (I think) for 5 (five!) litres of grow/bloom.......wouldn't it be in Greens interest to keep you on the Canna nutrient??


I don't get any residue in my Hesi bottles; but yes I do get crusty bits around the top of the bottle - this is where nurtient has leaked/split out when taking nutes from the bottle....the moisture evaporates and leaves the salt stuck to the sides of the bottle

Hey, i have no idea about Canna/Hesi nutes, but to play devils advocate here - although it may be more expensive to you, there might be more margin for him in the Hesi nutes.

As a wise, old (and very rich) businessman once said to me...

Turnover is for Vanity, Profit Margin is for Sanity.

Sorry to butt in, i have nothing to add, really.

Keye.

We have a similar saying here too Keye.....volume for vanity, profit for sanity.

What does a 5 litre pack of canna coco cost out of interest?
I've only ever bought 1 litre bottles.

well just done search

hesi coco bloom 5ltr £27.95 in shop £17.99 + postage and packing if brought on web ( witch intales using credit card and have it delivered to you home address

canna coco 5ltr £32.95


if brought in shop theres only about 5 pound in it

using a combined grow and bloom just makes no seance to me, really limits the styles of successful grows you can do......hence I use Ionic Coco Grow and Bloom.

sorry also if ya fancy it try cogr vega cogr flores witch canna has been makeing for 18 years


so wy not give it a go

hears a little bit how to use the canna cogr range

use cogrr vega upto the end and including the first 2-3 weeks of the flowering period (u know the 12/12 bit) once growth has peaked and flower formation begins, it is time to start useing the cogr flores about 4 weeks befor the end of flowering the plant needs more phosphate and potassium witch can be supplied by adding pk13/14 for one week. stop giveing flores a week befor harvasting. just use plane water for the last week

dilution 1:250 ec 1.8-2.7 mS/cm2 ph 5.5-5.8


hope this help out

i always used canna nutes and i have used then for years too with good results but the last year and a half i have had nothing but problems in me grow room plants locking out all the time
i dont know what they been up to but they not the same as they used to be i recently changed over to hesi and this is the first decent plants i have grown in over a year
its hesi for me from now on canna nutes have done my head right in
even formulex works better for me than canna

My experience has been exactly like yours NMW.....exactly. I tore one of my grow spaces apart looking for a non-existent problem, and that was 3-4 days worth of pain in a space with shitty access.

I don't understand what you are saying peps1.....why does grow/bloom formula limit the 'styles of sucessful grow'??
Ionic are decent nutrients.....I've had good results with their range.
I decided to try the Hesi as well.....and to be perfectly honest, I was stunned that something so simple could work so well.
They say the proof of the pudding is in the eating.....well I've been chomping on bowls full of fruit crumble and custard for the past year or so now

ATB

Do you have any connection with canna dam?
You seem to want to push their products and it appears to me you are chosing not to read or respond to what I am posting.........I'm not for one minute suggesting I'm an authority on coco growing (or growing per se).....I'm just posting what I've experienced.
You've suggested using Canna cogr nutrients.....I'm not too sure on this, but aren't they for use on coco slabs or coco that has been recycled.??

Did you or do you get a salt build up in the bottom of your Hesi bottles......or are you talking about crusty leakage/spillage from the top of the bottle?

Nail on the head! Hesi are allegedly great nutes, but you can't knock canna just because you're the UK distro of Hesi!!! Fair play to Greens, but buyer beware.

greens may be located in an area with water that dont suit canna , round my way shops say it fine , we have good water

if i go to growell they will say dont touch it , i argued with them once sayin i been using it for a while and its fine

the coco and hydro ive had no props

i think its down to your water

Have you read the whole thread Ninja.....read what both NMW and I have posted??


I don't think the guy is having a go at Canna just because he is a distributor.
I personally think he is just telling it like it is.

I agree and have said as much more than once.

ATB

Yup....I think that's the other nail on the head.....imho three factors:

Water Quality + Nutrient Profile + Strain Specific Dialling In = Results

I think most people play around with nute profile and dialling in for specific crops, but not many go the RO route if they've got shitty water (like us poor Londoners living under EC0.6 pH8 crud out of the tap).

Yeah mate, I've read the thread....but you can't help but think that advice from a distributor is going to be biased, no matter how cool they are - business is business. I'd do the same....am fairly certain any savvy businessman would do....it's not lying, or bad practice, or unethical...it's just business

But the point is, and I think you made it, it's about what works for you in your water area and nute regime, nay even strain.

I need to try out Hesi....got mate using it for his first grow and he's getting unreal results (defined by me as a forearm length elephant cock of a cola!!! Serious 2 foot chunk (6-8" thick) from a 10 week MMGxG13 in 11l, coco, drobe, 400w coolshade, all hesi nutes.

As for Canna, I think it comes down to what you like your smoke to taste like....as opposed to the results it gives in grow....

it used to work for me but it dont anymore and i am in a soft water area my water has not changed but i think the nutes have and i am on about hydro nutes use to be called substra

Not a hydro man but i would defo be using a 2 part feed, it just seems common sense to me.

Reason i'm saying that is say your plant starts to yellow due to lack of N, normally with a 2 part feed you can up the grow a little to give it the N it needs but with the canna stuff your going to have to up the lot which is then giving the plant extra bloom feed also which isn't really a good thing as it could cause burning and maybe also this could be why the nutes lockup for some of you's

I could be totally wrong but thats just my thinking

E2a:- Greens Horticulture are also listed on canna uk as being a CNNA Preferred Dealer so really doubt that has anything to do with it.

i used canna for over 15 year without problems only the last year and a half its caused me so much chew they say the name has only changed but not the nutes i disagree

Whoever span you that line has hooked you a treat

Greens are NOT!!! distributors for Hesi I dunno why on earth peeps make such false accusations Greens are merely retailers of products, they are not wholesalers and have no need or reason to be. They are simply put, another shop trying to help the end user by giving any sort of feedback they have gathered whether positive or criticism from the end users......there cutomers. They seem to listen to their customers and try to give an over view of all the products they have to offer which imo is fair and hopefully precise.

I've never grown in coco personally, so really can not comment on the nutes to use etc, but after reading all the probs peeps have been experiencing I think I would steer clear of the canna range

Well, GN; I am in business and though I do understand what you are saying, that type of attidude is very short term.
Yes, you may sell or push a little more of a particular product in the short run, but the repeat business will die......people just don't like dealing with lying fuckers

Sure, I want my smoke to taste great......I also want a problem free grow and the weight I expect from my plants and space.

Just for the record.....I don't think canna nutes work well with RO water........tried that one and spent the whole grow chasing defficiencies.

ATB

be nice to hear if anyone else is having chew with canna nutes
i used to love canna but not any more
it used to work fine for me but just can not grow with it anymore anyone else having the same troubles ?
has it changed whats your thoughts ? personally i think it has

Thanks for the replies peeps, Maybe It is very dependent on your local water, I'm gonna finish with the canna I've got then I'll do a head to head with 2 Identical setups, That'll certainly sort it for me. then I'll go head to head with the winner against another manufacturer.

I'll report back in about 24 weeks...



p.s. as Greens sell Canna thats as good as damnit a distributor in my book, my local shop is reporting people saying the same thing mind and our local water (Northumbrian Water from kielder is top notch!)

i have trouble with either too much nutes at start of life or not enough, if i feed full strength its too strong an if i feed half strength its too weak,
ive never had any probelms other than this lil mis hap at early stages, flowering an end of life cycle still have nice green leaves. other than that i found they still work really well for me so cant complain.

just for peoples info (like anybody cares ha ha) there is more than one person using this name dam, so if views/opinions differ/change er...thats why
i personally believe that nutrients are the last thing to worry about, environment environment environment, then add most ranges of nutes into the mix and your away. As you go from country to country you see the different companies have a hold in the market usually due to the amount of marketing/distribution they have invested in that area. I have found that people will back their nutrient choice because to admit they have an inferior product indicates a lack of knowledge and god forbid anybody should admit that, pride, what a stumbling block to progress or any rational thought or discussion.
but of course you all know bio bizz is the best
oh by the way i use bio bizz

dam.....I agree with what you are saying about the environment. It is fundemental IMO to the grow.
That said, the correct nutrition is important to get the best out of the environment you have created.

The simple fact of the matter in respect of canna coco nutrients is they are not what they used to be.
I am usually very careful when using the word fact, but I genuinely believe it to be the case.

I (and others in this thread) have found; most definately, that in situations where canna nutrients have previously produced excellent results, they now no longer do so. My own plants have shown various nutrient lock outs, most commonly I believe to be calcium related, where previously they performed excellently.

I accept that water quality can change, but people from all around the country have experienced exactly the same over the past 18 months / 2 years.

Don't really want to get embroiled in this one, but I think Greens deffo does well out of Hesi - check out what he says about the soil nute. "The best blah blah, use all the additives blah blah"

So lets get this right, according to mister impartial Hesi is better than Canna at coco and better than Biobizz at soil. Right.

For the above read: MAKES MORE on Hesi than Canna at Coco and MAKES MORE on Hesi than BioBizz for soil.

It's all horses for courses and if he was being really impartial, then that's what he'd say. Not "This is the best" because you blatantly can't just say that.

Ive used canna coco nutes and coir for years with good results.
Unlike most seem to be saying i think it has enough N,actually too much for my liking for a bloom nutrient,hence i start adding PK 13/14 as early as week 2 12/12.I only veg for 10-14 days tho so maybe on a longer veg period i would notice problems.

However i have noticed a change in the makeup of the nutes.First thing i noticed was the different PH change.At 1.8ec my ph was usually 5.8 ish....now it is 5.2....so there was summat up.not a big deal and didnt cause me any grief.

My theory is that the canna coco solution has been "tweaked" to suit the whole of the UK.Whereas before it may have been a regional recipe.Basically all the hydroshops are getting a standard product to sell everywhere.I think this because of the problems people describe...yellowing,calcium deficcienes etc....I dont think there is a soft / hard water version of canna coco so it would seem that they have tried to make a cover all.

Just my 2p.

Does this mean the answer is to use a nutrient that comes in SW and HW formulations?

Also, Ferro do region specific nutes tailored for specific water chemistries. There's a grow shop in south London that carries it but it's a load of cash to get involved in the whole system....but I don't think it's particularly expensive compared to other stuff.

My water's so hard it makes Begbie leggit