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Peppi
hi all

seen molasses mentioned around and about a few times ..

just wondering if anyone could give me any info about why and when its used

thanks

peppi smoke.gif
Hashishin
I always thought that they where used in flavouring blunt wraps unsure.gif, but I have also seen people on here using it when watering/feeding their plants or something g.gif . I am unsure what specific sort of molasses are used, how it is used and what effects it has?
Basically I don't have a fecking clue rofl.gif.

H.T.
stoned.gif
Peppi
QUOTE(Hardcore Toker @ Jun 2 2008, 01:30 PM) *
I always thought that they where used in flavouring blunt wraps unsure.gif, but I have also seen people on here using it when watering/feeding their plants or something g.gif . I am unsure what specific sort of molasses are used, how it is used and what effects it has?
Basically I don't have a fecking clue rofl.gif.

H.T.
stoned.gif


same here bud havent got a clue myself 34.gif doh.gif whistling.gif

but got about 2-3 litres of the stuff as i add it into my fishing bait

peppi smoke.gif
Jim_jim
I might be wrong here, but I don't think it directly does anything to the plant like add taste or give bigger buds.
Instead it does something to the micro-organisms in the soil.
Something like that anyway. I'll try and find a decent article on it
Jim_jim
Here it is

QUOTE
this is a Three Little Birds article from Overgrow -

"There are a number of different nutrient and fertilizer companies selling a variety of additives billed as carbohydrate booster products for plants. Usually retailing for tens of dollars per gallon if not tens of dollars per liter, these products usually claim to work as a carbohydrate source for plants. A variety of benefits are supposed to be unlocked by the use of these products, including the relief of plant stresses and increases in the rate of nutrient uptake. On the surface it sounds real good, and while these kinds of products almost always base their claims in enough science to sound good, reality doesn’t always live up to the hype.

The 3LB are pretty well known for our distrust of nutrient companies like Advanced Nutrients who produce large lines of products (usually with large accompanying price tags) claiming to be a series of “magic bullets” - unlocking the keys to growing success for new and experienced growers alike. One member of the three_little_birds grower’s and breeder’s collective decided to sample one of these products a while back, intending to give the product a fair trial and then report on the results to the community at Cannabis World.
Imagine, if you will, Tweetie bird flying off to the local hydroponics store, purchasing a bottle of the wonder product - “Super Plant Carb!” (not it’s real name) - and then dragging it back to the bird’s nest. With a sense of expectation our lil’ bird opens the lid, hoping to take a peek and a whiff of this new (and expensive) goodie for our wonderful plants. She is greeted with a familiar sweet smell that it takes a moment to place. Then the realization hits her. . .
Molasses! The “Super Plant Carb!” smells just like Blackstrap Molasses. At the thought that she’s just paid something like $15 for a liter of molasses, our Tweetie bird scowls. Surely she tells herself there must be more to this product than just molasses. So she dips a wing into the sweet juice ever so slightly, and brings it up to have a taste.
Much the same way a sneaky Sylvester cat is exposed by a little yellow bird saying - “I thought I saw a puddy tat . . . I did I did see a puddy tat . . . and he’s standing right there!” - our Tweetie bird had discovered the essence of this product. It was indeed nothing more than Blackstrap Molasses, a quick taste had conformed for our Tweetie bird that she had wasted her time and effort lugging home a very expensive bottle of plant food additive. Molasses is something we already use for gardening at the Bird’s Nest. In fact sweeteners like molasses have long been a part of the arsenal of common products used by organic gardeners to bring greater health to their soils and plants.

So please listen to the little yellow bird when she chirps, because our Tweetie bird knows her stuff. The fertilizer companies are like the bumbling Sylvester in many ways, but rather than picturing themselves stuffed with a little bird, they see themselves growing fat with huge profits from the wallets of unsuspecting consumers. Let us assure you it’s not the vision of yellow feathers floating in front of their stuffed mouths that led these executives in their attempt to “pounce” on the plant growing public.
And the repackaging of molasses as plant food or plant additive is not just limited to the companies selling their products in hydroponic stores. Folks shopping at places like Wal-Mart are just as likely to be taken in by this tactic. In this particular case the offending party is Schultz® Garden Safe All Purpose Liquid Plant Food 3-1-5. This is a relatively inexpensive product that seems appealing to a variety of organic gardeners. Here’s Shultz own description of their product.
“Garden Safe Liquid Plant Foods are made from plants in a patented technology that provides plants with essential nutrients for beautiful flowers and foliage and no offensive smell. Plus they improve soils by enhancing natural microbial activity. Great for all vegetables, herbs, flowers, trees, shrubs and houseplants including roses, tomatoes, fruits, and lawns. Derived from completely natural ingredients, Garden Safe All Purpose Liquid Plant Food feeds plants and invigorates soil microbial activity. Made from sugar beet roots! No offensive manure or fish odors.”
That sure sounds good, and the three_little_birds will even go as far as to say we agree 100% with all the claims made in that little blurb of ad copy. But here’s the problem, Shultz isn’t exactly telling the public that the bottle of “fertilizer” they are buying is nothing more than a waste product derived from the production of sugar. In fact, Schultz® Garden Safe 3-1-5 Liquid Plant Food is really and truly nothing more than a form molasses derived from sugar beet processing that is usually used as an animal feed sweetener. If you don’t believe a band of birds, go ahead and look for yourself at the fine print on a Garden Safe bottle where it says - “Contains 3.0% Water Soluble Nitrogen, 1.0% Available Phosphate, 5.0% Soluble Potash - derived from molasses.”
The only problem we see, is that animal feed additives shouldn’t be retailing for $7.95 a quart, and that’s the price Shultz is charging for it’s Garden Safe product. While we don’t find that quite as offensive as Advanced Nutrients selling their “CarboLoad” product for $14.00 a liter, we still know that it’s terribly overpriced for sugar processing wastes. So, just as our band of birds gave the scoop on poop in our Guano Guide, we’re now about to give folks the sweet truth about molasses.
Is The Story Behind This Sweet Sticky Garden Goodness?
Molasses is a syrupy, thick juice created by the processing of either sugar beets or the sugar cane plant. Depending on the definition used, Sweet Sorghum also qualifies as a molasses, although technically it’s a thickened syrup more akin to Maple Syrup than to molasses. The grade and type of molasses depends on the maturity of the sugar cane or beet and the method of extraction. The different molasses’ have names like: first molasses, second molasses, unsulphured molasses, sulphured molasses, and blackstrap molasses. For gardeners the sweet syrup can work as a carbohydrate source to feed and stimulate microorganisms. And, because molasses (average NPK 1-0-5) contains potash, sulfur, and many trace minerals, it can serve as a nutritious soil amendment. Molasses is also an excellent chelating agent.

Several grades and types of molasses are produced by sugar cane processing. First the plants are harvested and stripped of their leaves, and then the sugar cane is usually crushed or mashed to extract it’s sugary juice. Sugar manufacturing begins by boiling cane juice until it reaches the proper consistency, it is then processed to extract sugar. This first boiling and processing produces what is called first molasses, this has the highest sugar content of the molasses because relatively little sugar has been extracted from the juice. Green (unripe) sugar cane that has been treated with sulphur fumes during sugar extraction produces sulphured molasses. The juice of sun-ripened cane which has been clarified and concentrated produces unsulphured molasses. Another boiling and sugar extraction produces second molasses which has a slight bitter tinge to its taste.
Further rounds of processing and boiling yield dark colored blackstrap molasses, which is the most nutritionally valuable of the various types of molasses. It is commonly used as a sweetner in the manufacture of cattle and other animal feeds, and is even sold as a human health supplement. Any kind of molasses will work to provide benefit for soil and growing plants, but blackstrap molasses is the best choice because it contains the greatest concentration of sulfur, iron and micronutrients from the original cane material. Dry molasses is something different still. It’s not exactly just dried molasses either, it’s molasses sprayed on grain residue which acts as a “carrier”.
Molasses production is a bit different when it comes to the sugar beet. You might say “bird’s know beets” because one of our flock grew up near Canada’s “sugar beet capitol” in Alberta. Their family worked side by side with migrant workers tending the beet fields. The work consisted of weeding and thinning by hand, culling the thinner and weaker plants to leave behind the best beets. After the growing season and several hard frosts - which increase the sugar content - the beets are harvested by machines, piled on trucks and delivered to their destination.
At harvest time, a huge pile of beets will begin to build up outside of the sugar factory that will eventually dwarf the factory itself in size. Gradually throughout the winter the pile will diminish as the whole beets are ground into a mash and then cooked. The cooking serves to reduce and clarify the beet mash, releasing huge columns of stinky (but harmless) beet steam into the air. Sometimes, if the air is cold enough, the steam will fall to the ground around the factory as snow!
As we’ve already learned, in the of sugar cane the consecutive rounds of sugar manufacturing produce first molasses and second molasses. With the humble sugar beet, the intermediate syrups get names like high green and low green, it’s only the syrup left after the final stage of sugar extraction that is called molasses. After final processing, the leftover sugar beet mash is dried then combined with the thick black colored molasses to serve as fodder for cattle. Sugar beet molasses is also used to sweeten feed for horses, sheep, chickens, etc.
Sugar beet molasses is only considered useful as an animal feed additive because it has fairly high concentrations of many salts including calcium, potassium, oxalate, and chloride. Despite the fact that it’s not suitable for human consumption and some consider it to be an industrial waste or industrial by-product, molasses produced from sugar beets makes a wonderful plant fertilizer. While humans may reject beet molasses due to the various “extras” the sugar beet brings to the table, to our plant’s it’s a different story. Sugar beet molasses is usually fairly chemical free as well, at least in our experience. Although farmers generally fertilize their fields in the spring using the various arrays of available fertilizers, weed chemicals (herbicides) are not used for this crop due to the beet plant’s relatively delicate nature.
There is at least one other type of “molasses” we are aware of, and that would be sorghum molasses. It’s made from a plant known as sweet sorghum or sorghum cane in treatments somewhat similar to sugar beets and/or sugar cane processing. If our understanding is correct, sorghum molasses is more correctly called a thickened syrup rather than a by-product of sugar production. So in our eyes sorghum molasses is probably more like Maple Syrup than a true molasses.
In the distant past sorghum syrup was a common locally produced sweetener in many areas, but today it is fairly rare speciality product that could get fairly pricey compared to Molasses. Because sorghum molasses is the final product of sweet sorghum processing, and blackstrap and sugar beet molasses are simply waste by-products of sugar manufacturing, it’s pretty easy to understand the difference in expense between the products. The word from the birds is - there isn’t any apparent advantage to justify the extra expense of using sorghum molasses as a substitute for blackstrap or sugar beet molasses in the garden. So if you find sorghum molasses, instead of using it in your garden, you’ll probably want to use it as an alternate sweetener on some biscuits.
That’s a quick bird’s eye look at the differences between the various types and grades of molasses and how they are produced. Now it’s time to get a peek at the why’s and how’s of using molasses in gardening.

Why Molasses?
The reason nutrient manufacturer’s have “discovered” molasses is the simple fact that it’s a great source of carbohydrates to stimulate the growth of beneficial microorganisms. “Carbohydrate” is really just a fancy word for sugar, and molasses is the best sugar for horticultural use. Folks who have read some of our prior essays know that we are big fans of promoting and nourishing soil life, and that we attribute a good portion of our growing success to the attention we pay to building a thriving “micro-herd” to work in concert with plant roots to digest and assimilate nutrients. We really do buy into the old organic gardening adage - “Feed the soil not the plant.”
Molasses is a good, quick source of energy for the various forms of microbes and soil life in a compost pile or good living soil. As we said earlier, molasses is a carbon source that feeds the beneficial microbes that create greater natural soil fertility. But, if giving a sugar boost was the only goal, there would be lot’s of alternatives. We could even go with the old Milly Blunt story of using Coke on plants as a child, after all Coke would be a great source of sugar to feed microbes and it also contains phosphoric acid to provide phosphorus for strengthening roots and encouraging blooming. In our eyes though, the primary thing that makes molasses the best sugar for agricultural use is it’s trace minerals.
In addition to sugars, molasses contains significant amounts of potash, sulfur, and a variety of micronutrients. Because molasses is derived from plants, and because the manufacturing processes that create it remove mostly sugars, the majority of the mineral nutrients that were contained in the original sugar cane or sugar beet are still present in molasses. This is a critical factor because a balanced supply of mineral nutrients is essential for those “beneficial beasties” to survive and thrive. That’s one of the secrets we’ve discovered to really successful organic gardening, the micronutrients found in organic amendments like molasses, kelp, and alfalfa were all derived from other plant sources and are quickly and easily available to our soil and plants. This is especially important for the soil “micro-herd” of critters who depend on tiny amounts of those trace minerals as catalysts to make the enzymes that create biochemical transformations. That last sentence was our fancy way of saying - it’s actually the critters in “live soil” that break down organic fertilizers and “feed” it to our plants.
One final benefit molasses can provide to your garden is it’s ability to work as a chelating agent. That’s a scientific way of saying that molasses is one of those “magical” substances that can convert some chemical nutrients into a form that’s easily available for critters and plants. Chelated minerals can be absorbed directly and remain available and stable in the soil. Rather than spend a lot of time and effort explaining the relationships between chelates and micronutrients, we are going to quote one of our favorite sources for explaining soil for scientific laymen.
“Micronutrients occur, in cells as well as in soil, as part of large, complex organic molecules in chelated form. The word chelate (pronounced “KEE-late”) comes from the Greek word for “claw,” which indicates how a single nutrient ion is held in the center of the larger molecule. The finely balanced interactions between micronutrients are complex and not fully understood. We do know that balance is crucial; any micronutrient, when present in excessive amounts, will become a poison, and certain poisonous elements, such as chlorine are also essential micronutrients.
For this reason natural, organic sources of micronutrients are the best means of supplying them to the soil; they are present in balanced quantities and not liable to be over applied through error or ignorance. When used in naturally chelated form, excess micronutrients will be locked up and prevented from disrupting soil balance.”
Excerpted from “The Soul of Soil”
by Grace Gershuny and Joe Smillie
That’s not advertising hype either, no product being sold there. That’s just the words of a pair of authors who have spent their lives studying, building, and nurturing soils.
Molasses’ ability to act as a chelate explains it’s presence in organic stimulant products like Earth Juice Catalyst. Chelates are known for their ability to unlock the potential of fertilizers, and some smart biological farmers we know are using chelating agents (like Humic Acid) to allow them to make dramatic cuts in normal levels of fertilizer application.
One way to observe this reaction at work would be to mix up a solution of one part molasses to nine parts water and then soak an object which is coated with iron rust (like a simple nail for instance) in that solution for two weeks. The chelating action of the molasses will remove the mineral elements of the rust and hold them in that “claw shaped” molecule that Grace and Joe just described.
As we’ve commented on elsewhere, it’s not always possible to find good information about the fertilizer benefits of some products that aren’t necessarily produced as plant food. But we’ve also found that by taking a careful look at nutritional information provided for products like molasses that can be consumed by humans, we can get a pretty decent look at the nutrition we can expect a plant to get as well.
There are many brand’s of molasses available, so please do not look at our use of a particular brand as an endorsement, our choice of Brer Rabbit molasses as an example is simply due to our familiarity with the product, one of our Grandmother’s preferred this brand.
Brer Rabbit Blackstrap Molasses
Nutritional Information and Nutrition Facts: Serving Size: 1Tbsp. (21g). Servings per Container: About 24. Amount Per Serving: Calories - 60;
Percentage Daily Values; Fat - 0g, 0%; Sodium - 65mg. 3%; Potassium - 800 mg. 23%; Total Carbohydrates - 13g, 4%; Sugars - 12g, Protein - 1g, Calcium - 2%; Iron 10%; Magnesium 15%; Not a significant source of calories from fat, sat. fat, cholesterol, fiber, Vitamin A, and Vitamin C."
How’s of Molasses
Undoubtedly some folks are to the point where they are ready for our flock to “cut to the chase.” All the background about molasses making and the various kinds of molasses is good, and knowing how molasses works as a fertilizer is great too, but by now many of you may be thinking - isn’t it about time to learn how to actually use this wonder product?! So this section of the “Molasses Manual” is for our birdie buds who are ready, waiting, and wanting to get going with bringing the sticky goodness of molasses into their garden.
Molasses is a fairly versatile product, it can serve as a plant food as well as an additive to improve a fertilizer mix or tea. Dry molasses can be used as an ingredient in a fertilizer mix, and liquid molasses can be used alone or as a component in both sprays and soil drenches. Your personal preferences and growing style will help to decide how to best use this natural sweetener for it’s greatest effect in your garden.
We will try and address the use of dry molasses first, although we will openly admit this is an area where we have little actual experience with gardening use. We’ve certainly mixed dry molasses into animal feed before, so we’re not totally unfamiliar with it’s use. Folks may remember from our earlier description of the various kinds of molasses that dry molasses is actually a ground grain waste “carrier” which has been coated with molasses. This gives dry molasses a semi-granular texture that can be mixed into a feed mix (for animals) or a soil mix (for our favorite herbs). Dry molasses has a consistency that was described by one bird as similar to mouse droppings or rat turds, (folks had to know we’d fit a manure reference in here somehow).
The best use we can envision for dry molasses in the herb garden is to include it in some sort of modified “super-soil” recipe, like Vic High originally popularized for the cannabis community. As we admitted, the use of dry molasses in soil mixes isn’t something we have personal experience with, at least not yet. We are planning some experiments to see how a bit of dry molasses will work in a soil mix. We believe that moderate use should help stimulate micro-organisms and also help in chelating micronutrients and holding them available for our herbs. The plan is to begin testing with one cup of dried molasses added per 10 gallons of soil mix and then let our observations guide the efforts from there.
Another option for molasses use in the garden is it’s use alone as a fertilizer. The Schultz Garden Safe Liquid Plant Food is a perfect example of the direct application of molasses as a plant food. Garden Safe products are available from a variety of sources, including Wal-Mart. Although we consider them overpriced for a sugar beet by-product, Garden Safe products are fairly cost effective, especially compared to fertilizers obtained from a hydroponics or garden store, and they can serve as a good introduction to molasses for the urban herb gardener.
Here are the basic instructions a gardener would find on the side of a bottle of this sugar beet by-product - Mix Garden Safe Liquid All Purpose Plant Food in water. Water plants thoroughly with solution once every 7-14 days in spring and summer, every 14-30 days in fall and winter. Indoors, use 1/2 teaspoon per quart (1 teaspoon per gallon); outdoors, 1 teaspoon per quart (4 teaspoons per gallon). 32 fluid ounces (946ml). Contains 3.0% Water Soluble Nitrogen, 1.0% Available Phosphate, 5.0% Soluble Potash derived from molasses.
In our own experience with Garden Safe Liquid fertilizers, we’ve used a pretty close equivalent to the outdoor rate on indoor herbs with some good success. Our best application rate for Garden Safe 3-1-5 ended up being around 1 Tablespoon per gallon ( 1 Tablespoon = 3 teaspoons). Used alone it’s really not a favorite for continuos use, since we don’t see Garden Safe 3-1-5 as a balanced fertilizer. It doesn’t have enough phosphorous to sustain good root growth and flower formation in the long term. It’s best use would probably be in an outdoor soil grow where there are potential pest issues. Animal by-products like blood meal and bone meal are notorious for attracting varmints, so Garden Safe sugar beet molasses fertilizers could provide an excellent “plant based” source of Nitrogen and Potassium for a soil that’s already been heavily amended with a good slow release source of phosphorous, our choice would be soft rock phosphate.
Blackstrap molasses could also be used in a similar fashion, as a stand alone liquid fertilizer for the biological farmer who needs to avoid potential varmint problems caused by animal based products. But, we really believe there is a better overall use for molasses in the organic farmer’s arsenal of fertilizers. Our suggestion for the best available use, would be to make use of the various molasses products as a part making organic teas for watering and foliar feeding.
Since many of the folks reading this are familiar with our Guano Guide, it will come as no surprise to our audience that molasses is a product we find very useful as an ingredient in Guano and Manure teas. Most bat and seabird guanos are fairly close to being complete fertilizers, with the main exception being that they are usually short in Potassium. Molasses is turns out is a great source of that necessary Potassium. As we learned earlier, molasses also acts as a chelating agent and will help to make micronutrients in the Guano more easily available for our favorite herbs.
A good example of a guano tea recipe at the Bird’s Nest is really as simple as the following:
1 Gallon of water
1 TBSP of guano (for a flowering mix we’d use Jamaican or Indonesian Bat Guano - for a more general use fertilizer we would choose Peruvian Seabird Guano.)
1 tsp blackstrap or sugar beet molasses
We mix the ingredients directly into the water and allow the tea mix to brew for 24 hours. It’s best to use an aquarium pump to aerate the tea, but an occasional shaking can suffice if necessary and still produce a quality tea. We will give you one hint from hard personal experience, make sure if you use the shake method that you hold the lid on securely, nobody appreciate having a crap milkshake spread over the room.
Some folks prefer to use a lady’s nylon or stocking to hold the guano and keep it from making things messy, but we figure the organic matter the manure can contribute to the soil is a good thing. Using this method we feel like we are getting the benefits of a manure tea and a guano top-dressing all together in the same application. If you prefer to use the stocking method, feel free to feed the”tea bag”leftovers to your worm or compost bin, even after a good brewing there’s lots of organic goodness left in that crap!
We also use molasses to sweeten and enrich Alfalfa meal teas. Our standard recipe for this use is:
4 gallons of water
1 cup of fine ground alfalfa meal
1 TBSP blackstrap or sugar beet molasses
After a 24 hour brew, this 100% plant-based fertilizer is ready for application. Alfalfa is a great organic plant food, with many benefits above and beyond just the N–P-K it can contribute to a soil mix or tea. We do plan to cover Alfalfa and it’s many uses in greater detail soon in yet another thread. We prefer to mix our alfalfa meal directly into the tea, but many gardeners use the stocking”tea bag”method with great effectiveness, both work well, it’s really just a matter of personal preference.
The alfalfa tea recipe we described can be used as a soil drench, and also as a foliar feed. And foliar feeding is the final use of molasses we’d like to detail. Foliar feeding, for the unfamiliar, is simply the art of using fine mist sprays as a way to get nutrients directly to the plant through the minute pores a plant”breathes”through. It is by far the quickest and most effective way to correct nutrient deficiencies, and can be an important part of any gardener’s toolbox.
Molasses is a great ingredient in foliar feeding recipes because of it’s ability to chelate nutrients and bring them to the “table” in a form that can be directly absorbed and used by the plant. This really improves the effectiveness of foliar feeds when using them as a plant tonic. In fact it improves them enough that we usually can dilute our teas or mix them more “lean” - with less fertilizer - than we might use without the added molasses.
Of course it is possible to use molasses as a foliar feed alone, without any added guano or alfalfa. It’s primary use would be to treat plants who are deficient in Potassium, although molasses also provides significant boosts in other essential minerals such as Sulfur, Iron and Magnesium. Organic farming guides suggest application rates of between one pint and one quart per acre depending on the target plant. For growing a fast growing annual plant like cannabis, we’d suggest a recipe of 1 teaspoon molasses per gallon of water.
In all honesty, we’d probably suggest a foliar feeding with kelp concentrate as a better solution for an apparent Potassium shortage. Kelp is one of our favorite foliar feeds because it is a complete source of micronutrients in addition to being a great source of Potassium. Kelp has a variety of other characteristics that we love, and we plan that it will be the topic of it’s own detailed thread at a future date. But, for growers that cannot find kelp, or who might have problems with the potential odors a kelp foliar feeding can create, molasses can provide an excellent alternative treatment for Potassium deficient plants at an affordable price.
That looks at most of the beneficial uses of Molasses for the modern organic or biological farmer. Just when you think that’s all there could be from our beaks on the topic of molasses, that molasses and it’s sweet sticky goodness surely have been covered in their entirety, the birds chirp in to say, there is one more specialized use for molasses in the garden. Magical molasses can also help in the control of Fire Ants, and perhaps some other garden pests.
Molasses For Organic Pest Control
One final benefit of molasses is it’s ability to be used in the control of a couple of common pests encountered in gardening. The most commonly known use of molasses is it’s ability to help control Fire Ants, but we’ve also found an internet reference to the ability of molasses to control white cabbage moths in the UK, so molasses could be an effective pest deterrent in more ways that we are aware.
As we said before, there are several references we’ve run across refering to the ability of molasses to control Fire Ants. Since we’re not intimately familiar with this particular use of molasses, and rather than simply re-write and re-word another’s work, we thought we’d defer to the experts. So for this section of the current version of the Molasses Manual, we will simply post a reference article we found that covers topic in better detail than we currently can ourselves.
Molasses Makes Fire Ants Move Out
By Pat Ploegsma, reprinted from Native Plant Society of Texas News
Summer 1999
Have you ever started planting in your raised beds and found fire ant highrises? Are you tired of being covered with welts after gardening? Put down that blowtorch and check out these excellent organic and non-toxic solutions.
Malcolm Beck1, organic farmer extraordinaire and owner of Garden-Ville Inc., did some experiments that showed that molasses is a good addition to organic fertilizer (more on fertilizer in the next issue). When using molasses in the fertilizer spray for his fruit trees he noticed that the fire ants moved out from under the trees. “I got an opportunity to see if molasses really moved fire ants. In my vineyard, I had a 500 foot row of root stock vines cut back to a stump that needed grafting. The fire ants had made themselves at home along that row. The mounds averaged three feet apart. There was no way a person could work there without being eaten alive! I dissolved 4 tablespoons of molasses in each gallon of water and sprayed along the drip pipe. By the next day the fire ants had moved four feet in each direction. We were able to graft the vines without a single ant bothering us.”
This gave him the idea for developing an organic fire ant killer that is 30% orange oil and 70% liquid compost made from manure and molasses. The orange oil softens and dissolves the ant’s exoskeleton, making them susceptible to attack by the microbes in the compost, while the molasses feeds the microbes and also smothers the ants. After the insects are dead, everything becomes energy-rich soil conditioner and will not harm any plant it touches. It can be used on any insect including mosquitoes and their larvae.
Break a small hole in the crust in the center of the mound then quickly!!! pour the solution into the hole to flood the mound and then drench the ants on top. Large mounds may need a second application. Available at Garden-Ville Square in Stafford, it has a pleasant lemonade smell.
According to Mark Bowen2, local landscaper and Houston habitat gardening expert, fire ants thrive on disturbed land and sunny grassy areas. “Organic matter provides a good habitat for fire ant predators such as beneficial nematodes, fungi, etc. Other conditions favoring fire ant predators include shading the ground with plantings, good soil construction practices and use of plants taller than turfgrasses.” He recommends pouring boiling soapy water over shallow mounds or using AscendTM. “Ascend is a fire ant bait which contains a fungal by-product called avermectin and a corn and soybean-based grit bait to attract fire ants. Ascend works slowly enough to get the queen or queens and it controls ants by sterilizing and/or killing them outright.”
Malcolm Beck also did some experiments with Diatomaceous Earth - DE - (skeletal remains of algae which is ground into an abrasive dust) which confirmed that DE also kills fire ants. He mixes 4 oz. of DE into the top of the mound with lethal results. According to Beck, DE only works during dry weather on dry ant mounds. Pet food kept outdoors will stay ant free if placed on top of a tray with several inches of DE
1Beck, Malcolm. The Garden-Ville Method: Lessons in Nature. Third Edition. San Antonio, TX: Garden-Ville, Inc., 1998.
2Bowen, Mark, with Mary Bowen. Habitat Gardening for Houston and Southeast Texas. Houston, TX: River Bend Publishing Company, 1998.

As we had also mentioned earlier, while researching the uses of molasses in gardening, we also came across a reference to it’s use in the control of white cabbage moths. Here’s what we found on that particular topic.
“I came across this home remedy from the UK for white cabbage moths.
Mix a tablespoon of molasses in 1 litre of warm water and let cool..
spray every week or every 2 weeks as required for white cabbage
moth..they hate it..and I think
it would be good soil conditioner as well if any drops on your soil..
It works for me...but gotta do it before white butterfly lays
eggs...otherwise you might have to use the 2 finger method and squash
grubs for your garden birds..

So there you have it, not necessarily straight from our mouths, but simply one more potential use we’ve discovered for molasses, with at least one testimonial for it’s effectiveness. As we said before, the use of molasses as an foliar spray, in addition to it’s potential use as a pest deterrent, would also serve to provide some essential nutrients directly to our plants, and would especially serve as an effective boost of Potassium for plants diagnosed with a deficiency in K. Healthy plants are more resistant to the threat of pests or disease, so molasses really is a multi-purpose organic pest deterrent."
felix_dzerjinski
When using bacterial inoculants for the compost most of these will need activating with a bit of molasses added to the water they are being bubbled in. Dose rate can be between 1 - 1/2 a teaspoon per litre.

Once a thriving micro herd has been established it doesn't hurt to give them an occassional feed with a dilute solution of molasses, maybe 1/2 a teaspoon per litre of water.
Peppi
thanks jim

thats some heavy reading dude rofl.gif rofl.gif rofl.gif ill injest what it says see if its worth bothering with

thanks bud

peppi smoke.gif
Flowery Haze
Holland and barrett sell black strap unsulphered molasses. Used it a few times on my plants, its like candy to the microherd.

I like it in my coffee.
grandad
i was looking up about molasses, apparrantly its what we call treacle, its best added to teas and compost bins. i cant do heavy reading, so i only pick bits up.
I Zimbra
QUOTE(Flowery Haze @ Jun 2 2008, 10:51 PM) *
Holland and barrett sell black strap unsulphered molasses. Used it a few times on my plants, its like candy to the microherd.

I like it in my coffee.

Tony 2th
yeah black treacle is cane molasses and contains Ca, Fe, Mg and Iodine too. get it from your grocer. good in treacle sponge pudding too.
jolene
Toffee!
KC
QUOTE(Tony 2th @ Jun 2 2008, 11:00 PM) *
yeah black treacle is cane molasses and contains Ca, Fe, Mg and Iodine too. get it from your grocer. good in treacle sponge pudding too.


Yeah it's good stuff, contains quite a bit of magnesium, in fact i bet if you use it from early flowering you'd never even need to use Epsoms, i'll give it a go on my next grow i think.
jolene
If you smell the Biobizz grow it seems to be mostly molasses
kolkol
ok i gotta question. I have never used this stuff but can it really make a diference to the micro organisms growing in your soil and plant if the water we use contains chlorine. im wondering cos i read and articul in that hydro magazine about the benefits of healthy bacteria and it basically said its hard to establish a decent amount of it in your soil if your water contains chlorine which i assume all tap water does. Anyone clear this up for me?
I Zimbra
let it stand for 24hrs and bubble it
kolkol
can anybody help me and explain what bubbling means? Is leaving the water for 24 hours standard practice?
showgirl
QUOTE(kolkol @ Jun 9 2008, 11:41 PM) *
can anybody help me and explain what bubbling means? Is leaving the water for 24 hours standard practice?

Bubbling....Shake the jug of water vigoriously to put air in the water or an air pump bubbling air into water like a fish tank. Showgirl
KC
I think the only reason to let the water stand is for some chlorine to evaporate....i'm not sure if it's standard practice, it just wouldn't be practical for me.
I Zimbra
Yes leaving it stand for 24hrs let's the chlorine evaporate and bubling it keeps it fresh and also speeds up the evaporation of the chlorine. When things start to get busy in my room I use 2 x 25ltr tubs so I allways have one ready...Blue Peter style
showgirl
QUOTE(KC33 @ Jun 10 2008, 07:51 AM) *
I think the only reason to let the water stand is for some chlorine to evaporate....i'm not sure if it's standard practice, it just wouldn't be practical for me.

At least let it stand to achieve room temperature!! Showgirl
"#"
hello peeps,

i fill 15ltr bucket, insert 1 air pump, with a big air stone.

then drop in an fish tank heater.

2/3 days later i use the water and then repeat will a full bucket again.

it does help to have insulation underneath bucket even cardboard.


.......#........
Randalizer
brilliant "#"! yahoo.gif Thank you!
felix_dzerjinski
bubbling also stop the water going anaerobic and encouraging pythium and other fungal spores

e2a:

Chloramine isn't removed by bubbling or leaving for 24 hours. So if your water company is using that instead of straight chlorine it'll take a good RO filter to remove.
Randalizer
MORE BRILLIANCE! rockon.gif
scraglor
letting the water stand for 24hrs is no good if your water is treated with chloromine, a lot of the water networks overlap from different water works, so more often than not your water will contain both chlorine and chloromine. should be able to find out what your local water contains with a google search, if not contact your supplier, my advice would be to never use tap water for soil growing, but obviously understand that for many this is unavoidable. rain water for me all the way!
I Zimbra
nice one ill look into that, what effect do the different types have on micro life?
Randalizer
I use tap water with chloramine and I think it is okay. Most microherds are bred to handle chlorine any ways.

Here is a link on how to filter chloramine. http://chloramine.org/chloraminefacts.htm
I Zimbra
i think im going to have to brew a tea using fresh tap water and see how long it takes
Peppi
anybody know the suggested dosage for molasses ie x amount per litre of water ????????

peppi smoke.gif
KC
QUOTE(showgirl @ Jun 12 2008, 09:58 PM) *
QUOTE(KC33 @ Jun 10 2008, 07:51 AM) *
I think the only reason to let the water stand is for some chlorine to evaporate....i'm not sure if it's standard practice, it just wouldn't be practical for me.

At least let it stand to achieve room temperature!! Showgirl



Why not just add some hot water? wink.gif
The Sheriff
QUOTE(I Zimbra @ Jun 12 2008, 10:41 PM) *
nice one ill look into that, what effect do the different types have on micro life?


Pretty much bad news according to Growing Edge magazine this is a quote called " Don't Kill Your Microbiology " ....

Organic gardeners using bio-extraction solutions or compost teas should use purified water. Anyone gardening with living micro-organisms such as beneficial bacteria, fungi, nematodes, mycorrhizae, and trichoderma must have chlorine-free and contaminant-free water in order for those helpful microbes to survive and flourish. Unfortunately, it's a rare grower who with a water source that's perfect for her prized plants. Letting city water sit out overnight may get rid of some free chlorine, but this technique won't work to reduce levels of chloramines or other contaminants in the water. Water from well or spring sources is often too high in minerals such as calcium, magnesium, sulfur and iron. This water may be fine to drink, but for hydroponics it may be too heavy with these minerals and may contribute to nutrient lockup.
Randalizer
QUOTE(KC33 @ Jun 12 2008, 04:04 PM) *
Why not just add some hot water? wink.gif



Are we paying attention here? whistling.gif We let water stand to evaporate off chlorine. Allowing it to get to room tempature is killing two birds with one stone. I don't know about you but I like to save work and energy whenever I can.
Randalizer
QUOTE(The Sheriff @ Jun 12 2008, 04:33 PM) *
QUOTE(I Zimbra @ Jun 12 2008, 10:41 PM) *
nice one ill look into that, what effect do the different types have on micro life?


Pretty much bad news according to Growing Edge magazine this is a quote called " Don't Kill Your Microbiology " ....



Speculation on their part. Do they have studies to prove this? I know OT1 (whose insights are priceless here) has talked to folks that make micro herd powders and when they breed them, they breed them to handle tap water chlorine. I've seen in my own grow room an improvement from using micro herds and tap water that was left standing out for at least 24 hours and I have chloramine in me tap water.

I wonder if Growing Edge magazine sells water filters or has advertisers that sell water filters. whistling.gif I've had my hydro shop try to play on my fears of chloramine by selling me a cheap filter that would not have done the job anyway (see link above).
The Sheriff
Heya ,
QUOTE
Do they have studies to prove this?
Dunno ,
QUOTE
OT1 (whose insights are priceless here)
agreed ,
QUOTE
seen in my own grow room an improvement from using micro herds and tap water that was left standing out for at least 24 hours and I have chloramine in me tap water.
, and me great stuff init guitar.gif ,
QUOTE
I wonder if Growing Edge magazine sells water filters or has advertisers that sell water filters
, dunno again , check it out some good readin .

showgirl
QUOTE(KC33 @ Jun 12 2008, 11:04 PM) *
QUOTE(showgirl @ Jun 12 2008, 09:58 PM) *
QUOTE(KC33 @ Jun 10 2008, 07:51 AM) *
I think the only reason to let the water stand is for some chlorine to evaporate....i'm not sure if it's standard practice, it just wouldn't be practical for me.

At least let it stand to achieve room temperature!! Showgirl



Why not just add some hot water? wink.gif

Have you ever had a chance to view what is in the bottom of your hot water heater.Reason for annual draining maintence of your heater to prolong it's life otherwise it'll rust on ya alot quicker and the quality of the water coming out of it.Hot water has alot of sulfer and crap.So if you use it to warm up your water everytime then ....not good for them.Alright once in awhile imo Showgirl.Rainwater doesn't have many minerals like earth water only what it picks up on the way through the atmosphere.I used to use it all the time until I heard that Showgirl
KC
QUOTE(Randalizer @ Jun 13 2008, 12:33 AM) *
QUOTE(KC33 @ Jun 12 2008, 04:04 PM) *
Why not just add some hot water? wink.gif



Are we paying attention here? whistling.gif We let water stand to evaporate off chlorine. Allowing it to get to room tempature is killing two birds with one stone. I don't know about you but I like to save work and energy whenever I can.




It was in response to this
QUOTE(showgirl @ Jun 12 2008, 09:58 PM) *
At least let it stand to achieve room temperature!! Showgirl


I believe it was me who mentioned about letting chlorine evaporate in the first place lol.gif
As for saving work- It would be a right ballache for me, sometimes i have to water them there and then, i can't afford to have big tanks of bubbling water ready etc.
I don't find it has any negative effect on my plants not letting it stand. As said already there is probably alot of other crap in teh water too.

Showgirl-I don't have a hot water tank, i know what you mean though, they build up a lot of skank. I got a combi boiler, the water is heated as and when. No doubt the pipes aren't perfect along the way but there ya go. It's quite a common practice to add warm water. I believe even Ot1 does it, if it's good enough for him biggrin.gif


showgirl
A common practice as if your stuck and you have to water them right away then by all means add some hot water to temp. better than shocking them with cold water. Not a common practice as adding hotwater every watering!!!! Bad habit you should break you lazy ...Showgirl whistling.gif



It's quite a common practice to add warm water. I believe even Ot1 does it, if it's good enough for him biggrin.gif
[/quote]
jolene
You don't need to add a fish tank heater - the warmer the water the less oxygen it holds. Just stand it where you are going to use it. Bada boom bada bing.
Better still use rainwater - no chlorine, lovely and soft and wont contain shit from the chemicals dissolved from the ancient piping that the bastards make us pay for upkeeping that waste 1/3 of the total water we pay for coz they don't repair them and if they do they leave a giant fucking hole in the street for months on end which fills up with rubbish and moquitoes and when you phone up to ask when they are going to fill in the giant hole that your kids can fall into a drown in because some twat has nicked the sub-standard barriers, they go "hmmmmmmmm we are really busy". NOT TOO FUCKING BUSY TO SEND 12 MEN TO DIG THE BASTARD HOLE AS THE SUN CAME OUT; 1 MAN DIG THE HOLE THE REST MAKING ROLLIES THEN DUCKING OUT THE PUB.
Sorry got a bit off topic there. Use rainwater - your plants will love you for it
Randalizer
~adds a rainwater cistern to his list of projects~
"#"
jolen

i do need a fish tank heater thats why i use it?. 34.gif

if i left me water out it would nearly be freezing and my girls dont like freezeing water.

so how would you propose i do it with out the heater. bearing in mind it sits bubbling away?.

everyone locations and surcumstances are different so saying it is not required, is silly!.



........#..........
Randalizer
Right now I use a small trash can (plastic sick.gif ) that is on a wood plate on a set of dolly wheels. I can move it around when it is full. It also keeps it off the cold concrete floor thus giving the water a better chance of warming up a bit.

When I rebuild me room and install bigger tanks, they will most likely be low and on the ground. Insulation and a heater will be needed, but also an air pump and air stone as there will not be to much of exposed water surface to fresh air. These pesky gas exchanges....
"#"
QUOTE(Peppi @ Jun 12 2008, 11:51 PM) *
anybody know the suggested dosage for molasses ie x amount per litre of water ????????

peppi smoke.gif



1 tablespoon per gallon is the recommended average i beleive?.



......#.......
Peppi
QUOTE("# @ Jun 13 2008, 11:52 AM) *
QUOTE(Peppi @ Jun 12 2008, 11:51 PM) *
anybody know the suggested dosage for molasses ie x amount per litre of water ????????

peppi smoke.gif



1 tablespoon per gallon is the recommended average i beleive?.
......#.......


cheers bud

peppi smoke.gif
"#"
Peppi

i just noticed you are hydro?. i dont no if that would be the same... there are definately other threads on the subject

http://www.uk420.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=109310


PLEASE CHECK FIRST!!!.



...........#............
I Zimbra
QUOTE(jolene @ Jun 13 2008, 10:26 AM) *
You don't need to add a fish tank heater - the warmer the water the less oxygen it holds. Just stand it where you are going to use it. Bada boom bada bing.
Better still use rainwater - no chlorine, lovely and soft and wont contain shit from the chemicals dissolved from the ancient piping that the bastards make us pay for upkeeping that waste 1/3 of the total water we pay for coz they don't repair them and if they do they leave a giant fucking hole in the street for months on end which fills up with rubbish and moquitoes and when you phone up to ask when they are going to fill in the giant hole that your kids can fall into a drown in because some twat has nicked the sub-standard barriers, they go "hmmmmmmmm we are really busy". NOT TOO FUCKING BUSY TO SEND 12 MEN TO DIG THE BASTARD HOLE AS THE SUN CAME OUT; 1 MAN DIG THE HOLE THE REST MAKING ROLLIES THEN DUCKING OUT THE PUB.
Sorry got a bit off topic there. Use rainwater - your plants will love you for it

ha ha chalk it up jolene! Nice rant!
There's a couple of fresh water springs not far from where I live, I was thinking of using water from it to brew teas.... Tho saying that its easier to collect rain water, duh
Peppi
QUOTE("# @ Jun 13 2008, 12:16 PM) *
Peppi

i just noticed you are hydro?. i dont no if that would be the same... there are definately other threads on the subject

http://www.uk420.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=109310


PLEASE CHECK FIRST!!!.

...........#............


no worries bud

not gonna fill me rez with it or anything just a general question really as ive got loads of it here i use for fishing

peppi smoke.gif
scraglor
QUOTE(Randalizer @ Jun 12 2008, 10:42 PM) *
I use tap water with chloramine and I think it is okay. Most microherds are bred to handle chlorine any ways.

Here is a link on how to filter chloramine. http://chloramine.org/chloraminefacts.htm



how do you work that out? there's very few things that chlorine doesn't kill!!! it's used to disinfect water!!! a few pathogens like cryptosporidium can survive because they go dormant to protect themselves, but you don't want a dormant microherd anyway! you can be pretty sure if you're using chloromine treated water you have no microherd, your plants are just feeding on the available nutrients in your feed and what's already available in the soil. no problem, but kind of defeats the object of being organic in the first place
scraglor
QUOTE(I Zimbra @ Jun 12 2008, 10:53 PM) *
i think im going to have to brew a tea using fresh tap water and see how long it takes



shouldn't take much longer, as soon as the chlorine/chloromine has died off the bugs will repopulate your brew, but if you repeatedly water your soil with the stuff they wont get a chance to establish properly, doesn't it take several months for the various fungi to form symbiosis with the plant? although i'm not 100% but i think the fungi will survive the chlorine better, the "friendly bacteria" will be quite damaged though.

showgirl
QUOTE("# @ Jun 13 2008, 10:28 AM) *
jolen


if i left me water out it would nearly be freezing and my girls dont like freezeing water.







........#..........


In defence of jolene bring your water in to the warmth for crying out load what's all this fish tank heater business anyway. 34.gif What are you growing a forest!! rofl.gif Sg
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