hi,
I'ts my first try and uptil now everything was going fine. i never fed them(if that means just giving them water and no fertilizer) until starting about 10 days ago when one of them started turning pale on the bottom leaves.
I generally water them about once a day, as i wait until they appear dry to me.
no i gave them 4ml per 1l water fertilizer almost every day. is that too much?
if so, should i rinse them, but the again that makes me scared of maybe overwatering them even more.
pls help!
will try to get some more(and clearer, sorry for that) pics up later, as i have to go now
ThxClick to view attachment
Full Version: Over- Or Underfeeding? Or Too Much Water?
QUOTE(oldtimer1 @ Nov 6 2003, 02:12 PM) 
Hmm a bit of compost science myth and magic, ramblings for sr to take to bits and play with.
The advise going back over a hundred years, was to crock pots to improve drainage and stop compost seeping out of the pots and keep worms out. All has proved to be totally wrong.
Especially with the advent of capillary beds or matting. What you really want is the same medium going from the top to the base of the pot so its capillary profile constant without a break. If you want to change the water/air/drainage capacity of a medium it is best to change the whole medium.
For the most healthy root profile, it is best to water with a fine rose over the entire the compost surface untill you get run through, this oxygenates the water/feed when applied, it also drives stale and toxic gasses down through the rootball drawing in fresh air as it drains down from saturated to its natural holding capacity.
It has been found that crocking pots rather than helping drainage to the surface a pot is standing on, in fact it inhibits it. This means whatever potting medium you use holds more water and less air than its natural capacity, the thicker the crocking level the worse the problem.
The best growing results come from a wet dry cycle, by dry I mean down to 5 or 6% of the composts wet capacity, if you go much lower than that the root ball will shrink away from the pot walls killing a large percentage of the fine feeder roots, you don’t want to do this as it sets the plant back and every time you do it, it will reduce the final yield a bit more. Another problem where a rootball is allowed to dry out to the shrinkage stage is that it is very hard to wet it properly again, What happens is the water runs off the surface and down the gap round the pot edges leaving 70% of the rootball dry.
If your plants are on a sand/matting bed providing there is no crocking the odd over dry rootball will fully rehydrate its self from the bed after the area has been watered.
It is not a good idea to water or feed from a capillary bed unless you have a very very open medium, if you are going to do this you might as well grow hydro.
Where the myth about needing 30 to 70% perlite in compost an an ideal medium for growing cannabis came from:-
In the early days of cannabis growing in the states, the heads growing indoors did not have a clue about gardening or horticulture at all. They wanted to grow plants like outdoors, big plants, so they would use a big pot 10 to 50 gallons fill it with a couple of bags of Schultz container compost, water, sow a few seeds.
Now we all know what happens to 10 gallons of saturated compost in an enclosed container, with no roots to pump the water out and just a little surface evaporation, within a couple of weeks the whole mess goes anaerobic and sour. To compound the problem, the surface dries so they keep watering the seedlings that in turn get sicker and sicker as root fungus get a grip in what is now an ideal environment for it.
Did they look at what the plant industry did? No they were growing cannabis they had to resolve the problem, they stuck with big pots. One method was to fill the pot and just use a tiny amount of water around the seed. Of course this meant watering several times a day as the surrounding compost sucked up the water. Then they tried adding more and more drainage! Grit, sharp sand and finally perlite. Until the 10 gallon pot was only holding 3 or 4 gallons of compost and the rest was inert filler ie they were nearly growing with just water and nutrients. They never learnt about standard potting on techniques or considered them irrelevant or too time consuming.
Even today 40 years on, where large pots and huge plants are no longer the thing. Then the firm belief was that for optimum yield you should not grow more than one cannabis plant under a 1kw light, no one even thinks about that now, its laughable.
Yet we still see people adding large amounts of inert perlite and vermiculite to compost. It just goes to show what a tough plant cannabis is, as it often survives and crops despite the things that are done to it. Its not done any where else in the horticultural industry. So why oh why, when its a completely groundless bit of nonsense does it still hang on in the cannabis world.
The advise going back over a hundred years, was to crock pots to improve drainage and stop compost seeping out of the pots and keep worms out. All has proved to be totally wrong.
Especially with the advent of capillary beds or matting. What you really want is the same medium going from the top to the base of the pot so its capillary profile constant without a break. If you want to change the water/air/drainage capacity of a medium it is best to change the whole medium.
For the most healthy root profile, it is best to water with a fine rose over the entire the compost surface untill you get run through, this oxygenates the water/feed when applied, it also drives stale and toxic gasses down through the rootball drawing in fresh air as it drains down from saturated to its natural holding capacity.
It has been found that crocking pots rather than helping drainage to the surface a pot is standing on, in fact it inhibits it. This means whatever potting medium you use holds more water and less air than its natural capacity, the thicker the crocking level the worse the problem.
The best growing results come from a wet dry cycle, by dry I mean down to 5 or 6% of the composts wet capacity, if you go much lower than that the root ball will shrink away from the pot walls killing a large percentage of the fine feeder roots, you don’t want to do this as it sets the plant back and every time you do it, it will reduce the final yield a bit more. Another problem where a rootball is allowed to dry out to the shrinkage stage is that it is very hard to wet it properly again, What happens is the water runs off the surface and down the gap round the pot edges leaving 70% of the rootball dry.
If your plants are on a sand/matting bed providing there is no crocking the odd over dry rootball will fully rehydrate its self from the bed after the area has been watered.
It is not a good idea to water or feed from a capillary bed unless you have a very very open medium, if you are going to do this you might as well grow hydro.
Where the myth about needing 30 to 70% perlite in compost an an ideal medium for growing cannabis came from:-
In the early days of cannabis growing in the states, the heads growing indoors did not have a clue about gardening or horticulture at all. They wanted to grow plants like outdoors, big plants, so they would use a big pot 10 to 50 gallons fill it with a couple of bags of Schultz container compost, water, sow a few seeds.
Now we all know what happens to 10 gallons of saturated compost in an enclosed container, with no roots to pump the water out and just a little surface evaporation, within a couple of weeks the whole mess goes anaerobic and sour. To compound the problem, the surface dries so they keep watering the seedlings that in turn get sicker and sicker as root fungus get a grip in what is now an ideal environment for it.
Did they look at what the plant industry did? No they were growing cannabis they had to resolve the problem, they stuck with big pots. One method was to fill the pot and just use a tiny amount of water around the seed. Of course this meant watering several times a day as the surrounding compost sucked up the water. Then they tried adding more and more drainage! Grit, sharp sand and finally perlite. Until the 10 gallon pot was only holding 3 or 4 gallons of compost and the rest was inert filler ie they were nearly growing with just water and nutrients. They never learnt about standard potting on techniques or considered them irrelevant or too time consuming.
Even today 40 years on, where large pots and huge plants are no longer the thing. Then the firm belief was that for optimum yield you should not grow more than one cannabis plant under a 1kw light, no one even thinks about that now, its laughable.
Yet we still see people adding large amounts of inert perlite and vermiculite to compost. It just goes to show what a tough plant cannabis is, as it often survives and crops despite the things that are done to it. Its not done any where else in the horticultural industry. So why oh why, when its a completely groundless bit of nonsense does it still hang on in the cannabis world.
hm, thanks for the general advice. I don't know if that came out from the OP,
but usually i let them dry out(or at least i think their dry) and then watered them again.
definitley i do that now, but today a plant had its leaves hanging down, eventhough it was still slightly moisty on the
surface.(and i'm pretty sure i'm not overwatering them THAT much)
so basically i still don't have a clue where from my yellowing-browning-crumpling leaves come and whether i should use fertilizer and how much of it.
sorry, if these are obvious questions to most of you, but i grow for the first time and don't know how to judge these things.
thx
QUOTE
I generally water them about once a day
Which is all wrong in compost,theres no need if you water and feed correctly
Your plants are showing also a lack of N
Owd
Hey Nuri and welcome to the site
Are you potting up as you go?
If you fill in your profile we will be able to help you more
QUOTE(sixpots @ Sep 4 2007, 08:30 PM)
Hey Nuri and welcome to the site
Are you potting up as you go?
If you fill in your profile we will be able to help you more
Are you potting up as you go?
If you fill in your profile we will be able to help you more
so if you say lack of nitrogen, owd, i assume i should not cut down with the fertilizer but keep going.
but should i add it with every watering? and is the dosage right as suggested on the bottle with 4ml per litre?
I'm not potting up, cause i don't want them to grow any more, cause my protection fence isn't much higher
and most of them haven't reached double of the size of the pot anyway(which i think should be enough space for them, or am i mistaken here?)
sorry, i don't know what you mean by filling in my profile, how do i do that?
thx a lot for your responses!
QUOTE(Nuri @ Sep 4 2007, 07:53 PM)
so if you say lack of nitrogen, owd, i assume i should not cut down with the fertilizer but keep going.
but should i add it with every watering? and is the dosage right as suggested on the bottle with 4ml per litre?
but should i add it with every watering? and is the dosage right as suggested on the bottle with 4ml per litre?
Here's another opinion for your collection:
With comericanl fert, you usually only want to feed the plant at most once a week (e.g use fert once a week) the other 1-2x a week you would just use plain water (and in terms of doseage, usually start with 1/2 the suggested dose of fert and work your way up, advanced nutrients and biobizz at least tend to be a bit... shall we say, overzealous.). I'd have to say with the burnt tips of the green leaf (latest picture). you're over fertilizing (especially if you're watering every day with fert!)
im not sure where you got your stuff from, or what it is. however pot loves nitrogen, and its almost allways the first thing to happen if just watering most composts from garden centers. dunno about shop bought, but im betting its the same.
your feed should have a feeding schedule as well as doseing. if its not for pot, then it will need adapting though.
what you using?
edit: i will let others guide you. reading the above bought back memorys. whats compost again?
your feed should have a feeding schedule as well as doseing. if its not for pot, then it will need adapting though.
what you using?
edit: i will let others guide you. reading the above bought back memorys. whats compost again?
Your profile will tell us more information about your grow(when you fill it in).
Click on my uk420 at the top of the page and go to edit profile and get it filled in
How old are your plants and have they allways been in the same compost?
You defo hav'nt overfertilised them going on that picture,they look like they are starving for nitrogen
You either want to pot up into fresh compost(which will feed them) or start a feeding regime
I cant tell you how much feed to add as i dont know what nutes you have
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