[Tomas]

Hello,

I read some interesting :

Dr. Frankel from GreenBridgeMed (google) says:

"I was initially going to post some thoughts I have concerning Cannabis causing psychosis, but decided not to because in summary, I believe the data for this is at best weak.

Of much more general interest is the relationship between Cannabis and anxiety. There are hundreds of articles/blogs claiming that either Cannabis causes anxiety or that it helps anxiety. I believe this is primarily strain related and will address this further, but wanted to first comment that many, many medications I have prescribed in the past have been for anxiety. However, in a certain percentage of patients, these pharmaceuticals would at times increase anxiety. So, this is certainly not rare and should not be a reason to dismiss the patients for whom Cannabis works well for anxiety.

So, back to the strains. In general those patients, who become agitated, paranoid or even perhaps borderline psychotic, have been using sedating strains of Indica. These strains tend to worsen our ability to focus and this results in calmness and sleep for most of us. However, for some patients with anxiety, this loss of focus triggers a loss of connection to their environment and paranoia may creep in. On the other hand, low doses of more activating strains of Cannabis very rarely, if ever, cause these symptoms.

In my personal clinical experience, the patients who seem to become increasingly anxious from Indicas, do very well on Sativa strains.





AND

Sativa Strains:

Activating
Anti-Anxiety
INCREASED Focus!
Anti-Depressant
Increased Creativity
Treats Chronic Pain
INCREASED LEVELS OF SEROTONIN


Indica Strains:

Sedating
Relaxing
DECREASED Focus!
Muscle Relaxant
Treats Acut Pain
Increased Appetite
Decreased Nausea
INCREASED LEVELS OF DOPAMIN"


What you think about that?

very interesting!

[Sawney Bean]

Nice wee read Tomas, thanks for posting

[~nobody~]

Interestng take on the subject. I'm off to google.

[Organic Jim]

very interesting, I've always thought that sat dom strains made my anxiety worse.
I'll have to read more.
Thank you,
OJim

[wildbill]

Nice find Tomas,

I'm particularlly interested in the Seretonin & Dopamine part. Will give this some thought. Might even be worth some experimentation .

[namkha]

interesting, but I don't buy that at all

in people prone to or vulnerable to anxiety after smoking pot then anything with THC in is potentially going to set them off

something with THC and CBD in would be better for them, but still any THC present will exacerbate things

---

I would strongly recommend anybody who find that cannabis makes them anxious to experiment with daily doses of Ashvagandha and Brahmi - two to three times daily

Ashvagandha
http://www.indigo-he..._somnifera.html

Ashvagandha in Sanskrit means " smelling like a horse ", probably originating from the odor of its fresh root which resembles that of a sweaty horse. Ashvagandha is a well known anti-stress herb. The species name somnifera means "sleep-bearing" in Latin, indicating it was considered a sedative, but it has been also used for sexual vitality and as an adaptogen. It is also popularly known as Indian Ginseng.

A unique herb with anti-stress adaptogenic action that leads to better physical fitness and helps cope with life's daily stress. It increases physiological endurance and protects against effects of stress. It is especially beneficial in stress related disorders such as arthritis, hypertension, diabetes, and premature aging.


Brahmi
http://www.indigo-he...a_monniera.html
http://www.himalayah...ucts/brahmi.htm

Brahmi or Bacopa monnieri, has been used for centuries to help benefit memory capacity, increase concentration, and reduce stress-induced anxiety. It is used as a nootropic, a drug that enhances cognitive ability.

Brahmi is a nervine tonic that enhances learning, academic performance and improves mental ability. It acts as an anti-anxiety agent and is used in several mental disorders. It also calms restlessness in children.

[Puff Adder]

Organic Jim, on 26 January 2012 - 05:23 PM, said:

very interesting, I've always thought that sat dom strains made my anxiety worse.
I'll have to read more.
Thank you,
OJim

That's been my experience too. Most of the time all I can get around here is Swazi. It's great if you want an up high if you need the energy and want to do things, also gives a great buzz for socialising, but I've found it tends to aggravate my anxiety a bit more than I like. A nice Indica strain packed to the rafters with CBD is just what I need. I am also subject to a frantic mind with racing thoughts all the time so I find the CBD does wonders to chill me out. I am a big fan of sedation I must say.

[namkha]

forgot to put the link to the Ashvagandha page above
http://store.himalay...ashvagandha.htm

Puff Adder, on 26 January 2012 - 06:51 PM, said:

A nice Indica strain packed to the rafters with CBD is just what I need. I am also subject to a frantic mind with racing thoughts all the time so I find the CBD does wonders to chill me out. I am a big fan of sedation I must say.

it's unlikely any of the well-known indicas you can get from the big seedbanks will have a medically significant amount of CBD - next to none, if any

CBD doesn't sedate you

it does counter anxiety though, and it also gives you a clearer more focused head, and a cleaner after effect

the mostly likely place you've experienced CBD is from smoking imported hash

the chance of finding a commercial indica strain from a big seedbank with a lot of CBD is slim - Twigs put a list of them up somewhere

Himalayan landraces will have CBD - and strains specifically bred for CBD will do

but in strains bred for high potency, CBD phenos get bred out by selecting for the most potent high THC pheno

This post has been edited by namkha: 26 January 2012 - 07:10 PM

[Boojum]

I think as far as cannabis and anxiety goes it is also (as with acid) about set and setting. If I'm with people and I'm mashed, kinda indica mashed, not really thinking straight then I can get anxiety cos I'm not really thinking straight, and I start to panic cos I'm mashed and maybe everyone else isn't and I'll look like a fool but I can't just come out and say "Look, I'm fucking mashed." cos I just can't come out and say that cos you just don't say that so I sit there being mashed and maybe occasionally saying stupid stuff (or even worse struggling to find something to say - that's the worst, struggling to find something to say and then you say nothing and you struggle to fill the gap in which you've said nothing and the longer the gap is the harder it is to find something to say and the silence is like a void that you can't fill and you think everyone thinks you're a weird cunt cos you're not saying anything, and that just makes it even harder to say anything )

But then there's also the anxiety on your own from smoking up smokes, sativas. When your head starts talking to itself and you want it to shut up but it won't shut up so you have to do something, anything just to occupy your mind to stop all the bad things going on in your head from going on and on and on and on and LEAVE ME ALONE.

My head does that anyway, without the smoke, that's why I drink. But couchlock smoke helps in both sithuations, in the former I just get proper mashed and don't care and in the latter I just get proper mashed and don't care too


E2A sorry, talking drunk shit again

This post has been edited by Boojum: 26 January 2012 - 07:12 PM

[Kratos]

Yeh, I definitely feel both of those types of anxiety Boojum.
The anxiety does seem to be much more present in high THC strains, irrelevant of sat or indica dom. and certainly dependant on particular patterns of thought as with all anxiety.
Alot of the higher CBD strains I have seen seen only have the high CBD pheno in 1/4 of plants or something, there doesn't seem to be many stable strains out there at the moment!
Was looking at Tulsi Brahmi tea, some people on here said it intensified dreams... does this contain the same thing you are talking about?

[grandad]

i hate to say this cos i get stick. i suffer from attention deficit. its a lack of concentration, and i'm still hyper. iv'e never used anything but cannabis for depression and axiety, but i need strong cannabis, and i need to smoke very often everyday. i dont see difference between sativa and indica, it all makes me quite speedy once i get up and running, and it all helps me wind down once my days done. having no concetration dont help seeing a diference. anyway i have stuck to my guns, apart from the odd panadol for bad headaches, thats only when i need work, iv'e gone all my adult life without antibiotics and pain killersmy motto is what i dont get through is the one i die from. i go to work with all sort of pain some days, but i'm stoned and happy, without pot i'm something i dont want to be. i live for cannabis, cannabis is my life. i depend on cannabis just to be a little normal, i know i will never be like other people, i cant relate to nobody i ever meet. peace and pot. music soothes my soul, people make me angry.

[wildbill]

I have not had much experience of anxiety, and when I have it was there before I smoked anything.

I often have sleep disturbance, despite this I will pick a sativa every time & find that they can help me. Tropical sativa, good imported hash & weed are my preference.

Don't usually like indica bud anymore, although I enjoy a smoke it sends me off on a bit of a tangent after a while.

Well put Booj, but for me things work a bit differently now. Perhaps due to my neurological problems .

[Tomas]

Boojum, on 26 January 2012 - 07:10 PM, said:

I think as far as cannabis and anxiety goes it is also (as with acid) about set and setting. If I'm with people and I'm mashed, kinda indica mashed, not really thinking straight then I can get anxiety cos I'm not really thinking straight, and I start to panic cos I'm mashed and maybe everyone else isn't and I'll look like a fool but I can't just come out and say "Look, I'm fucking mashed." cos I just can't come out and say that cos you just don't say that so I sit there being mashed and maybe occasionally saying stupid stuff (or even worse struggling to find something to say - that's the worst, struggling to find something to say and then you say nothing and you struggle to fill the gap in which you've said nothing and the longer the gap is the harder it is to find something to say and the silence is like a void that you can't fill and you think everyone thinks you're a weird cunt cos you're not saying anything, and that just makes it even harder to say anything )

damn - please! Whats that called? The thinking and cant say anything thing? I have the same sh*t going on since I was 18 years old. Also without ANY weed! My head is so fu**ing racy - thoughts n thoughts that's why I stopped smoking back in the days (not the only reason).

But the problem stays- so I don't think its only a cannabis induced problem. All the problems I had back in the days- I personally thought all come from the weed- because almost my whole surrounding thought that (of course the family- "no our son is not crazy- he is smoking- thats the problem").

Your head thing I always have if I'm with some people- or at a party or something else... I'm so used to it- that I tried to start not to care about it any more... but its like a death within you- it stops you from living you as yourself!

I also had a "little" alcohol problem, but I stopped at a point I had a chance to give it up and not fully addicted. But always I take some medication with alcohol - I remember those days of being drunk- the nice warmth coming up into the head- and the relaxation of thoughts. And the burning after a sip... there was nothing like a pure whiskey... burn ;-)

But I also stopped that- because alcohol caused very straaange willies in my head with time. I had anxiety attacks from alcohol next day - hard attacks with destroyed consciousness - my mind was playing tricks... (sorry my english)

So I never understood people- how they can stand smoking- or drinking or something else- for decades... I wish I would be as "strong" as them...


But back to the anxiety and cannabis thing:


I would prefer a clear focus - that's all

I can't stand those depressive cold states of beeing stoned. It feels nasty to me.

I like to be cooled down a lot- to be relaxed yes- but not this "oh men its the same procedure as every day mary jane" kind of thing. I want to be creative - having energy - and relax if I want to. And these things I'm not able to produce by myself- that's the point. Apart from having something for my body and my pain, and muscle, inflammation and rheumatic problems (CBD for example) and apart from having something for my psychological illness- I'm praying for feeling good. And the only times I had that the last 7 years was- if i tried to smoke the night before. The 4 first hours- which people enjoy most- was a trippy thing to me- but the next day.... full of energy... feeling the sun... enjoing listening to music... "welcome day - I love my live" ... this is the reason why I'm very very interested in Cannabis.

But in the end... perhaps its nothing for me... but hope is what keeps me going.

That's why I thought Dr. Frankel could be right - in my case.

Regards

[Puff Adder]

Namkha, what you say sure sounds like it makes sense, but am I not correct in thinking if you harvest as late as possible much of the THC degrades and you are left with more CBD? That would explain why one crop of Original Blueberry that I grew had such a clear and pure high, no signs of an increase in anxiety whatsoever and I know that isn't a pure Indica Himalayan landrace.

[Otherwise L.A.C.]

Smellyberry.


Gives me zero anxiety. I'm unsure if it was the phenotype, genotype or the length of flower. I'm eager to grow another to try and replicate the effects.