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pepe16

new grower
New Grower. Intro and some simple advice

Hi All

I hail from the emerald isle, though spent most adult life in London.  Had to come back here (northern part) a few years ago.

 

I'm just starting out growing.    Last summer, without any reading, bought an AK Automatic x 2.  Tried the papertowl thing, but forgot to water it.  It died.   Second seed, straight to soil in summer (indoors during night, day outside)  autoflowering.  Came on a serious pace, til i killed it by overwatering, and putting in a pot with no drainage.

 

Got three narcotherapy autos from barneys seeds.   Got a 300w cfl dual,  planted seeds, two in small pots with numerous airholes all round in 50/50 mylar, and one straight into an 18.6L fabric grow bag.      The one in the grow bag was three times the size of the other two,  it was at least ten inches from seed around week three I think,  then because I just had the lamp suspended above plants balanced precariously on a mirror, and ikea box (didn't know about grow tents), it collapsed, and two small plants were killed, and the big one, was cut in half.

 

I kept it growing,  moved it into a 50cmx50cmx100cm black orchid tent, with fan, but no extractors,  just vents open, for airflow, as there is little scent from it.    Started nutrients, but fucked that up as well, as I realised i ordered the Canna hydro specific nutes.     Anyway, she is fighting to the last, and a mate gave me a scientific level microscope with four different lens strengths.  Strong enough to pick up the striations in metal.     So, I'll use that to check up on her trichomes (I've been reading round the clock and watching videos, as I'm disabled, so have the time to devote, well, all my time, to learning very quickly,  and am taking great delight in simply growing something I KNOW the strain,  and having the pleasure, in due course, of smoking something I knew as a tiny seed.)  for the right time to harvest......need to read and watch more about drying and curing...

 

Anyway, I'm sorry if this should have all been posted in different sections,   but my disability affects my, er thinking, so sometimes if i don't put it down when i think of it, i forget entirely.

 

I just need some advice.   Being an all in sort of person,  I bought 3 lamps, apart from the beginner cfl.     They are a dual 600 hps, a 600 veg hps or mh..one red and one blue.   Also bought a cheap chinese "80 watt true output" led multi spectrum,  as the price was ridiculous, but reviews good, and thought it would be an experiment.

But to get to the point.    As I said, the black orchid tent 50x50x100, which I'm super pleased with as i got it from the ventilation hub on ebay, over 25 cheaper than on amazon,  is i think, only suitable for one plant?    As cash is a bit tight,  I can't at the moment order a large black orchid suitable for up to four to five plants,  so after watching a vid on youtube about making your own grow space using cardboard,  I ordered two double thickness cardboard wardrobes (used by movers to put your shirts into straight off the peg), and planned to join them together.  

They are double thickness and measure 50+ (few extra cms) square at the bottom, and over 80cm tall.     I worked out , as I'm shite with number stuff, that no matter what way I join them, they will have still the 50cm width,  but a 100mm length.    As they only cost under £8quid a wardrobe,  getting another two, and joining all together, will give 100mm length and width i.e. 1m squared.     Already bought the black/white reflective lining, plus have enough mylar to ensure total coverage of reflective material.   I also (I also have OCD and paranoia lol) bought polystyrene to insulate the cardboard before attaching the mylar.

Now, and again apologies for not posting in relevant forums,  as I'm pressed for time to return the lights..i.e. the dual 600, which I don't need,  or all three for something smaller.   Already got the dimmable digi ballast (refurbed from manufacturer choice of 200 400 or 600w),  but need to know if I put all the boxes together to make a diy home made grow space,  to accommodate four plants,  do I need 600w lamps?   I'll be going the blue and red phase hid's.  Or should I get 400w lamps instead? 

Last but not least, can you point me in the direction of how to set up an extractor fan and ducting.   Got the ducting and the filter,  but looking at the online fans,  I can't see how to connect them up.   Recommendations on the cheapest, but decent quality fans would be appreciated, as this will be a full time activity, albeit on a small scale. My brain needs simple explanations, as due to some brain trauma,  memory is shot,  and I need childlike step by step instructions.      A lot are advertised as inline fans,  so I figure they are connected by ducting at one end,  then attached to the filter at an exhaust port,  but what about the intake?  Is it simply a short piece of ducting material sucking in air?  Or am I missing something?

Finally,  in a set up like this,  what be the recommended intake intake fan?    The filter is 4",  a hefty piece of gear.      Also, last one,  I put four seeds in an electric propagator two days ago using a root riot pod,  soaked in rain water then squeezed, surrounded by compost.   One has germinated already.    Should I now give them lighting, (they're in bedroom, so just get room light)   I have a cfl 55watt doing nothing in particular, and could easily hang this over them...

Sorry for all the questions....its just that Ive only three days left to request a return on the lamps, so input on that alone would be useful.    As for the rest, you can redirect me to the proper forum.

Being disabled (mentally and physically), basically,  groups of people I avoid, or all people on certain days,  but can walk to an extent,  and move in short spaces,  means I have full time to devote to learning about these little beauties,  reading and watching,  and it has given me a whole new Major interest.        I could buy the finished project, but what prices they charge are galling,  plus I could never enjoy it not knowing Exactly what it is.........I was only interested to this extent in motorbikes before, hence injuries,  but this has been like an awakening.

Again, my apologies for cramming so much into an intro post,  but just need some guidance on the lamps.  The rest,  I'll read all your posts.      But planted three peyote critical (photos) and a violator kush, but that got left out overnight after 24hours soaking,  and i gave it a squeeze to make sure it wasn't fag ash, but planted now, but I might have fucked it.     My trip to specsavers is long over due.

 

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High,

 

Damn thats a lot of questions, haha. 

 

First pick which size you will use, and someone can advise on the lights.  50x50x100cm to me sounds too small for either one 600w HPS or MH.  The larger size I can't advise on, but if you are making out of cardboard then you will need to put the fan and filter outside as they are probably too heavy to hang without a metal frame.  I think a tent maybe a better idea to be honest - less messing about and proabbaly holds weight, smells in etc better...

 

Again the fan depends on size, for 50x50x100cm 4" may well be adequate for your needs.

 

Fans, filters and ducting all slide onto each other and then you use a jubilee clip to fasten them.  If parts are different sizes then you also need fittings to make large to small or small to large.  You can also get purpose made fancier fittings.

 

Most of this should probably be in another forum, yeah, ha.

 

Best of luck with your grow.

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Thanks for that.   I agree you're right.  Better to save for a bigger black orchid (the small tent is pure high quality).   As I'd got the cardboard already,  I could just use it for keeping a mother plant in,  as I would eventually like to get into cloning,  and use the cheapo chinese led bank of lights (same size as mars hydro,  and it does give off blistering light) for that.     Shame to chuck it, but I agree, I ideally want a 1.2m squared x 2m height,  black orchid.      So instead of ordering another £16 for two extra cardboard set ups,  I can simply attach the two together for double insulation and strength in the meantime,  transfer to the bigger black orchid, when I can afford it in twelve days (on benefits, as classified, pretty much permanently unable to work) and then use it for clones under the 300w dual cfl.         I'll post in the fan section for recommendations about that.    I read, here in another thread, a guy regularly used a 600 dual spec hps for four plants as standard.    Having read a bit about lights,  I'm drawn to the different hps for veg, and mh for flowering.    I'll return the dual spec hps, as it won't be needed.  Ordered accidentally, as i didn't realise it was in my "shopping basket".   

Thank you for the reply.

 

And apologies for cramming so much into the intro section.  Once I start typing, the brain takes over, and it is an impatient thing, as it realises it has a limited viable operational period ha ha, to get it's stuff out.      

 

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you can put the filter before or after the fan, and in the tent or not - you just need enough ducting. 

 

The easiest way to intake air is passively -- you see the side flaps in the tents?  Thats a passive intake - so if using your box then you would need to cut an intake hole at least 4 times the size of the extraction hole, and during flowering you may well need to light proof the intake too, for this I made a light baffle:

 

Toptip: To search for things on here I go to a search engine and type UK420 + topic

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10 minutes ago, pepe16 said:

Thanks for that.   I agree you're right.  Better to save for a bigger black orchid (the small tent is pure high quality).   As I'd got the cardboard already,  I could just use it for keeping a mother plant in,  as I would eventually like to get into cloning,  and use the cheapo chinese led bank of lights (same size as mars hydro,  and it does give off blistering light) for that.     Shame to chuck it, but I agree, I ideally want a 1.2m squared x 2m height,  black orchid.      So instead of ordering another £16 for two extra cardboard set ups,  I can simply attach the two together for double insulation and strength in the meantime,  transfer to the bigger black orchid, when I can afford it in twelve days (on benefits, as classified, pretty much permanently unable to work) and then use it for clones under the 300w dual cfl.         I'll post in the fan section for recommendations about that.    I read, here in another thread, a guy regularly used a 600 dual spec hps for four plants as standard.    Having read a bit about lights,  I'm drawn to the different hps for veg, and mh for flowering.    I'll return the dual spec hps, as it won't be needed.  Ordered accidentally, as i didn't realise it was in my "shopping basket".   

Thank you for the reply.

 

And apologies for cramming so much into the intro section.  Once I start typing, the brain takes over, and it is an impatient thing, as it realises it has a limited viable operational period ha ha, to get it's stuff out.      

 

 

I use LEDs, I am sure your unit is at least good enough to keep a mother, so good idea

 

 

I think you have it wrong about the lights.  If I were to run HPS and MH then I would use the MH for veg and the HPS for flower (or maybe both for flower, or maybe HPS until the last couple of weeks then switch to MH).  If I only had one lamp then it would be HPS.  Not sure how a dual spectrum HPS works, but it probably has more blue compared to normal HPS.  This maybe a good option... dunno.

I also think that in 120x120cm a 600W HPS is adequate.  I am sure people use more lights / higher wattage but then you need to consider more variables.  But like I say, I use LEDs/CFL, so please let others guide you on lights.

 

 

 

Edited by elmer budd
added info
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I have never seen a black orchid tent.  The corners should be metal, not plastic.  The thread count or D of the material should be high (at least over 600D).  The zips should be light proof.  Mine has a green window which is quite useful.

Edited by elmer budd
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Hey man, it's really good you're being so open about the mistakes. It's good to learn. I think we've all forgotten about seedlings at some point throughout our journey or dried them out. It's trial and error. Just try and collate your post into sections to make it easier for people to reply. Some people have masses of knowledge but little time so may not post for you.

 

" I just need some advice.   Being an all in sort of person,  I bought 3 lamps, apart from the beginner cfl.     They are a dual 600 hps, a 600 veg hps or mh..one red and one blue.   Also bought a cheap chinese "80 watt true output" led multi spectrum,  as the price was ridiculous, but reviews good, and thought it would be an experiment. "

 

" Now, and again apologies for not posting in relevant forums,  as I'm pressed for time to return the lights..i.e. the dual 600, which I don't need,  or all three for something smaller.   Already got the dimmable digi ballast (refurbed from manufacturer choice of 200 400 or 600w),  but need to know if I put all the boxes together to make a diy home made grow space,  to accommodate four plants,  do I need 600w lamps?   I'll be going the blue and red phase hid's.  Or should I get 400w lamps instead?  "

 

Do your research on the lights. There is a HUGE amount of comparison data. Which ones are best, but more important, why. The technology varies therefore the outputs are different. I see people varying their grow type depending on commonly their environment, rather than they need. E.g, LED for low heat low wattage usage.

 

For you right now, I would park the LED light for the time being and focus on getting your setup tuned in and process repeatable. I would personally stick with one lamp, don't over complicate it for the time being. Here's a post on dual spectrum but you won't see a comparable difference as yield data for `dual` is limited UK420 Dual spectrum vs straight HPS. I think you've already figured you don't need it though. But don't forgot it's one of the most commonly used lights in the industry globally. A lot of people like the MH for resin production, but the frequency of light is the only data I've seen, again just stick with one setup and try it. 300w for the seedlings is a lot, you could use T5 strip tubes of even get them under the dimmable at 250w HPS. If you're sending the HPS back of course, just make sure they don't get too hot with the 300w CFL in a tight space.

 

Don't purchase any more lights. You will just be adding masses of variation into your routine.

 

" But to get to the point.    As I said, the black orchid tent 50x50x100, which I'm super pleased with as i got it from the ventilation hub on ebay, over 25 cheaper than on amazon,  is i think, only suitable for one plant?    As cash is a bit tight,  I can't at the moment order a large black orchid suitable for up to four to five plants,  so after watching a vid on youtube about making your own grow space using cardboard,  I ordered two double thickness cardboard wardrobes (used by movers to put your shirts into straight off the peg), and planned to join them together.   "

 

If money is tight, you will unlikely be able to buy top end fans. I would advise, to buy a 5" fan with acoustic insulation with a fan control to slow it down. That won't be cheap, but keeping noise to a minimum is always welcome. Fan's are the noisest item in a setup. Low cost small fans can make a lot of noise! Plus using reducers, you can still use 4" ducting. Bigger fans are always useful if you get heat issues too. A single fan will work for air in and out, imagine you create a vacuum inside the tent, that will pull air in. Use the advice regarding baffles to ensure you can allow air to enter the sealed wardobes. I love tents, I think they have the benefit of having so many air paths it makes easy for for single fan setups.

 

Finally,  in a set up like this,  what be the recommended intake intake fan?    The filter is 4",  a hefty piece of gear.      Also, last one,  I put four seeds in an electric propagator two days ago using a root riot pod,  soaked in rain water then squeezed, surrounded by compost.   One has germinated already.    Should I now give them lighting, (they're in bedroom, so just get room light)   I have a cfl 55watt doing nothing in particular, and could easily hang this over them...

 

Google the amount of air you need to move, you should calculate the amount of air you need to move. This will will give you detailed review of what air you need. Air is measured in CFM - cubic feet per minute. You can work out your grow space volume then make sure the fan spec is correct. I still advise a 5" fan, buy a controller and keep air movement quiet and controllable.

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Welcome to the site :)

 

First off I admire your tenacity, keep at it, growing is the best way to learn about growing if that makes sense. 

 

Keep things as simple as poss to start with. Environment is the main factor to get right. Get as close to perfect as you can, and plants will grow themselves. A good filter is essential also. 

 

It would be a good idea to start a diary, that way you will hopefully get plenty of passers by that will offer advice. There are some very skilled and helpful people here. 

 

Good luck! :yinyang:

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Hello and welcome,

 

i cant cant really give any advice as I'm only 11 days into my first grow.

 

i will however say that last year I rammed some random bagseeds into pots without any knowledge of growing. They didnt have enough light or heat and ended up being long spindly pale seedlings that eventually went in the the bin.

 

It peeked my interest enough to read about how to do it properly and with the help and advice of the kind folks on this site my grow is underway.

 

I think you'll find plenty of information and help here.

 

best of luck to you!:bong:

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Hi and welcome!! Very good luck with your grow...

 

I think its been said, but, you could get a plant going in the 50X50 - your LEDs will do for a start, but the 600watters are too big. That 4" filter is fine for that tent too and you can reuse all of that kit for a veg space or keeping a mum later when you get the floor space you want to do a few more plants!

 

Good luck!

 

:v:

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5 hours ago, Slugums said:

Hi and welcome!! Very good luck with your grow...

 

I think its been said, but, you could get a plant going in the 50X50 - your LEDs will do for a start, but the 600watters are too big. That 4" filter is fine for that tent too and you can reuse all of that kit for a veg space or keeping a mum later when you get the floor space you want to do a few more plants!

 

Good luck!

 

:v:

Thanks for the very helpful replies guys.   The tent, I'd bought to use with a 200cfl dual spectrum (red/white).   I got the big lights to use in a bigger tent,  just went OTT!  The LEDs were dirt cheap, but seem pretty solidly made all the same and put out some dazzling light and have two internal fans.      I'll do the maths on the airflow,  of a homemade tent to accommodate 3 plants.  The small tent,  I'll use for one plant.     

Three peyote critical seeds have germinated already in an electric propagator.  24 hours soaked in rainwater, then into root riot cubes.  Amazing...came up after 36 hours!    I'll read the grow diaries of members to see what I should be recording.

 

Thanks again for all your helpful advice :)     I'll post other queries in the appropriate sections.

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I never tried Leepy's box for noisy fans, but its a cheap option, FYI

 

 

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