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Guest uzi

Boxing

3,521 posts in this topic

The trouble is, we won't ever really know if Khan was following his trainers advise, I did hear Roach tell Khan to use the uppercut as he was wide open down the middle yet Khan only used it three or four times, he has to follows instructions. But I do agree the tactics were wrong, regardless of who's fault it was, Khan has no plan B. punch in combinations and move, it's ok against decent fighters but when you start moving up the rankings your going to come unstuck

Can't wait for the rematch

Gunner

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Injoying the debate chaps just think it to easy to blame the trainer and the tactics 1st couple of rounds he was doing everything right then presher and and he fools to pieces now that ain't roaches thought be4 the PAC man fight I fought speed was the biggest thing in boxing. now timing with PAC man and presher with khan and they both didn't no what to do next up we have got grit vs skill in froch and ward hoping 4 a cracker what do we think

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I think Khan was looking past Lamont and thought his speed would be enough. He forgot the basic tool with a walk you down fighter, a ffing stiff jab, his prob was he was moving too much and not setting himself, made it a lot harder for himself than it should have been. We could easily blame the trainer but a fighter can leave a trainer any time he likes and also doesn't have to take his advice if he thinks he knows better. Khan is quality just had a bad day at the office, his so called big name scalps in all fairness are way past best but a necessary stepping stone. Froch is the man, i also like Cleverly.

Barker.. here's a plan ill walk forward with my hands high and hope he punches himself out, piss poor, you work your way in not walk and there a thing in boxing called lateral and head movement. ;)

Brook.. Got good skills, typical Ingle gym style but he gets clipped by geezers that shouldn't be getting clipped by and never really been tested in my opinion. As he steps up he better stop getting caught, cause chins get better and dudes punch harder at the top, well some.

Trouble with British boxing is a lot of the fighters lack movement, lateral and head.

Murray..static

Barker...static, the list could go on.

British level and world level are worlds apart and you can count on one hand the British fighters that deserve to be that line up.

You wanna see a man move and throw combos, watch Jonny Tapia.

Watch De la Hoya v miguel angel conzales to see how you break someone's heart with a jab.

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It is too easy to blame the trainer. Make no mistake I was hesitant to even say that because it's the sort of shite trotted out too often by too many people, and too quickly. Believe me, I hate seeing fighters sack their trainer because it shows a lack of responsibility and respect, respect for the trainer who helped them get where they are, and responsibility for what they do inside the ring.

But there's more reasoning to what I'm saying. It's not something I'm saying lightly

With Amir, he seems like a good listener, someone who pays full attention to Roach. I don't think there's a chance he'll leave him, and that's the difference.

At this point in his career he is doing things which should be ironed out in the gym, but it seems they're not. Gunner, I take on board what you say about Roach telling him to use the uppercut, and you're right about that. But the way Khan defends is atrocious for a fighter competing at the level he's fighting at, which is testament to how good his other attributes are. I think his defence is the worst in his division, bar none. The fact that he hasn't got a solid chin makes that a disaster waiting to happen.

It's like watching a football team go out and defend too deep and hit long balls to a star striker. That's Khan's game right now. You want to see him push up and pressurise and hold the midfield. Those things are entirely tactical and the manager/trainer bares a lot of the responsibility for that.

The Peterson fight answered a lot of questions regarding the truth of Khan's improvement, as did the Marqeuz fight for Pacquiao. If him and his team can't stategise a better formula for when he's under pressure than just run, the nhe's in big trouble when and if he fights Bradley.

For those that don't know, Peterson fought Bradley not so long ago. You should try and youtube that fight because it's very interesting and you'll see exactly what I mean.

The rematch will be very interesting and if Khan thinks it was hometown judging that made the fight so close on the cards, maybe the real wake up call might come on his own doorstep. Peterson needs to watch the replay though and realise himself how badly in trouble Khan was and how he could have actually finished it inside the distance.

........

Onto big fight this weekend though.

Super 6 Final: Carl Froch v Andre Ward

Massive fight for both fighters and a huge fight for British boxing.

I don't think there's ever been a tournament like this. If this was the future of boxing what a boost for the sport. Best fighters in the division fighting each other in a league system then a knockout (no pun) competition leading to the final.

Ward is going to be hard to get through. The lad came into this tournament largely unproven, but his domination of the world level Kessler - the fighter who beat Froch - cemented his place at world level and his favourite status in the competition.

He outboxed Kessler all fight, but in is fight against Alan Greene proved his ability to fight inside, dominating the whole fight and winning every single round by bullying Greener to the ropes and basically just roughing him up. He showed two sides to his game that make him a hard fight for Froch no matter where it takes place.

Personally I see him winning a decision against Carl, but Froch is there til the end and imo he'll be Ward's toughest opponent. If it goes the distance I think Ward wins and wins clearly. I think the only way Froch gets a win is by KO. But this is no walkover for either man.

Should be a fascinating fight.

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I think Khan was looking past Lamont and thought his speed would be enough. He forgot the basic tool with a walk you down fighter, a ffing stiff jab, his prob was he was moving too much and not setting himself, made it a lot harder for himself than it should have been.

Good point mate and nice to see someone else who's into the boxing.

Khan neglected his jab in a way I haven't seen him do in a fight. It's usually his biggest weapon. Another punch he failed to throw was the lead right. Like you say he never sat down on anything, there was no in between. He was either running and throwing telegraphed combos which were little more than a deterrent to Peterson's pressure, or he was jumping in a holding him. It was crude and awkward to watch at times, especially for a fighter with such handspeed who could and should be holding the center of the ring.

But a big big weakness is no inside game, and the reason for that, in my opinion, is his total lack of a defence. He buries himself behind a not very tight guard and doesn't even look at his opponent.

You see many different defensive styles in boxing, you've got the philly shell used by Hopkins, a crab-like guard which was synonymous with Winky Wright, held up high in a peekaboo pose, absorbing shots, then releasing well times stiff counters.

Then you've got the high shoulder guard, perfected by Floyd Mayweather, where the turn of the body and the shoulder is used to roll high punches. Both these styles, and many others, allow the fighter to see his opponent and time counter punches.

Khan seems to not have a defensive style. His defence seems to be hide. That's it. Stick your head down and put your hands over your face. It's something that's got to be worked on in the gym, got to be. He shows no head movement either - another thing he desperately needs.

If he had a good defensive style, at least an idea of one, he'd be able to stand his ground more and with his hand speed he'd be able to tag people on the counter no end.

Without some idea of a plan in that regard, without the ability to hold his ground better, I can't see him every fulfilling his potential. What do you think?

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I had the pleasure of watching B Hop train at the boxing hall of fame one year, you wanna see a knockout, watch Hopkins starch joe lipsy..a banger and undefeated, he never fought again after Hopkins turned the lights out. Youre on the money with Khan, we know he's fast, he knows his fast, that comes natural to do with muscle twitch fibre, same thing makes a man run faster than another. So to point he has handspeed, good movement, its defence under pressure it seems to go out the window. It's part of the learning curve cause when you are used to knocking everyone over, who needs defence eh. Khan will learn from this stop counting his chickens and get back down to it. Thing is I'm not sure what happened, Lamont likes to counter but doesn't really faint much, thats what Khan should have done fainted him all night, draw the shots and make him pay. Then in spurts his nice combos, sit down on em and move off. One thing i was impressed with was his turn out, looked fit as and handled the 12 which is encouraging and hes def not chinny, that Prescott punch would have stopped 99.9% of any fighter. He's filling out now so I see him up a weight and he'll take his speed and power with him, he tried to show how macho he was for whoever he wanted to impress and it lost him the fight.

I rate Roach highly great fighter and trainer but I wonder if his condition is having more of an effect on him.

I rate Buddy McGirt, he did wonders with Gatti...R.I.P

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Love me boxing chaps great to see guys on hear who clearly no there boxing

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Any of you lot watching box nation ?

Selby - Simpson main event & the undercard is top notch

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Yea, watching it now ;)

Where do you lot watch the fights, online or what?

pm me if you want

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Anyone see the Froch Ward fight?

Ward was on another level to Froch. He's got it all. Outboxed Carl with ease, Bullied him on the inside, traded with him when he wanted to... There's probably no more rounded boxer fighting today. He's that good. Hard hard fighter to beat.

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The Cobra failed to turn up, he was that short with some of his punches, i thought he was sat in the crowd.

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Just been watching a bit of Tyson v Lewis on Tube, that Lewis is a cunt, he ducked Tyson in his prime, a fake in my eyes! Tyson still took him into late rounds. I hate Lewis

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I think they just matured at different times,it's not Lennoxs' fault that Tyson went off the rails.I like Lennox,he was a decent champion but Tyson is and I suspect always will be my all time favourite.

The feeling you got the week/night of a Tyson fight just isn't there with any of the current mob,it's sad.

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I agree WAP, but I still think Lewis ducked him

I love Tyson, got about 5k worth of signed stuff,sad I know but I have a fascination with him

Best fighter imom

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The fella Lewis really ducked is Vitali Klitschko. I'll never forget that when Vitali asked him for a rematch and Lewis said yes, but when Klit showed him the camera he fucked off sharpish. Bit of a rat move by Lewis. He never gave Vitali any credit leading up to or after that fight and never did give him a rematch. Vitali was robbed that night by a freak injury and for Lewis not to give him a rematch tainted his reputation big time. Especially since he was outboxed and in my opinion on his way to being battered and knocked out in that fight.

Tyson was a superstar and like any superstar he had the wrong people around him, which meant a career that should and could have spanned over a decade lasted just a few years.

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